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Thread: Collecting Dimensions - Bullet Data

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  1. #11
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    Verrry Interesting!

    This thread is a good lesson for handloaders who ask for a COAL for some unidentified, off-the-wall 230gn RN bullet. So far, there have been bullet lengths reported for 7 different non-hollow point 230gn RN bullets (plain lead, plated, jacketed, etc.) and they run from 0.634 to 0.674 inch long.

    If the same seating depth is assumed, the COAL's could differ as much as 0.040"!

    The shortest possible 45 Auto bullet weighing 230 grains (with 0.452" OD) would be only 0.500" long, so keep them cards & letter comin' folks. Someone's bound to have a 230gn RN (non-hollow point) bullet shorter than 0.634" (the shortest reported so far).

    Regards
    When you can measure what you are speaking about, and express it in numbers, you know something about it; but when you cannot measure it, when you cannot express it in numbers, your knowledge is of a meagre and unsatisfactory kind. [Lord Kelvin]

  2. #12
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    Looks like it will be a lot of work! Thanks for taking the time to service the membership. Hope all is well...
    Get Involved In Protecting Your Gun Rights And Your Life
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  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by niemi24s
    This thread is a good lesson for handloaders who ask for a COAL for some unidentified, off-the-wall 230gn RN bullet. So far, there have been bullet lengths reported for 7 different non-hollow point 230gn RN bullets (plain lead, plated, jacketed, etc.) and they run from 0.634 to 0.674 inch long.


    Regards
    help me with this one, Niemi,

    Looking at the numbers, what factors contribute to the different lengths on a bullet that have same dia and weight?

    example, of the two LRN I measured, the Oregon trail is is nearly .030 longer, yet both weight the same.

    OOPS, nevermind, I "think" I might of figured out why.
    The OT has fairly deep lube grove and a beveled base.
    The Hornady doesn't use a lube grove, it's more like a very, very shallow checkerboard pattern and no bevel.
    That missing lead from the grove and bevel, is the additional length on the nose...i "think"....

    BTW, I didn't weigh any of mine, only measured ligth and dia.
    i used the manufacture's listing for wt.
    But I just went to down and weighed the two LRN slugs when I was wondering "how could be be so"

    OT weighed in at 229gr
    Hornady @ 230.8


    ..L.T.A.

  4. #14
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    Hi Cap:

    Another thing that makes a difference (other than the volume you just figured out) is the density of what the bullet's made out of. If you take a pure lead bullet and make a jacketed one out of it, you essentially replace an outer layer of lead with copper or brass (or whatever the jacket's made out of). The bullet may have the exact same shape and volume, but the jacket materials are only about 75% as dense as the lead they've replaced.

    F'rinstance: a 0.452" diameter X 0.500" long cylindrical lead bullet will weigh 230gn; replace the outer 0.020" of lead with a lighter copper jacket 0.020" thick and the bullet will now weigh 218gn.

    0.020" Is about the jacket thickness on the GI Ball bullets I've sectioned. Plated bullets (at least CCI BB ones) have jackets only about 0.004" thick:



    Cheers
    When you can measure what you are speaking about, and express it in numbers, you know something about it; but when you cannot measure it, when you cannot express it in numbers, your knowledge is of a meagre and unsatisfactory kind. [Lord Kelvin]
    Last edited by niemi24s; 12th January 2010 at 09:25.


  5. #15
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    Hi all, Ill contribute data from two bullets I have on hand that havent been listed yet.


    Hornady encapsulated 200 FMJ-CT (swc) #45157, length- 0.615", nose length- 0.352", diameter- 0.451".


    Hornady 200 XTP #45140, length- 0.569", nose length (hard to measure)- 0.297", diameter- 0.4505 (edited after measuring with new method)


    This is good stuff, Im hoping someone will post data for the hornady 230 gr TC FMJ bullet.

    Thanks
    Last edited by jsirm; 15th January 2010 at 14:56.


  6. #16
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    Hi Jsirm: to the Forum!

    Thanx for the info., especially the nose lengths.
    Quote Originally Posted by jsirm
    . . .nose length (hard to measure)- 0.264". .
    Yeah, they sure are hard to measure - measure directly, that is. Don't know how you do it, but I find it a lot easier (and probably a lot more accurate) to measure the body (the 0.451 or 0.452" dia. part) length and then subtract that from the total length, like this:



    But then, I can get pretty anal when it comes to nitnoy stuff like this - probably analer than most folks!

    Regards
    When you can measure what you are speaking about, and express it in numbers, you know something about it; but when you cannot measure it, when you cannot express it in numbers, your knowledge is of a meagre and unsatisfactory kind. [Lord Kelvin]


  7. #17
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    Thanks Neimi24. The xtp I measured has a truncated cone profile so my original measurement was just eyeballing the radius where body meets nose. Using your method I came up with a longer nose. The SWC profile of the other hornady bullet isnt so simple to measure either, as there is a slight radius on the shoulder, I measured from the shoulder "ledge". Using your method would come up with a shorter body as well.

    Which measurement do you think yields the most useful data for the swc?

    Thanks

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsirm
    Which measurement do you think yields the most useful data for the swc?
    I do exactly the thing when getting SWC dimensions. Measure the total length. Mark, scrape & measure the body length and then calculate the nose length. All because without the marking & scraping I find it impossible to eyeball exactly where the nose meets the body - even on a SWC.

    If there's no load data giving the COAL for that specific SWC bullet, experience tells me the starting COAL can be found from: COAL = (Nose Length) + (≈0.030") + (Case Length). Do the math, load up a dummy test cartridge and see if it looks OK to your eye. Provided you know what to look for and how a SWC cartridge should look, this'll prevent loading a bunch of goofy cartridges like these:



    (The three on the right were tried, but failed to feed. Waaaay too short!)

    Then see how the dummy feeds.

    Regards
    When you can measure what you are speaking about, and express it in numbers, you know something about it; but when you cannot measure it, when you cannot express it in numbers, your knowledge is of a meagre and unsatisfactory kind. [Lord Kelvin]

  9. #19
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    Aim Projectiles (Canada)
    230gr
    RN Copper Plated
    lgth .629
    dia .451

    Frontier Metal Processing (South Africa)
    200gr
    Copper Plated Flat Point or Truncated Cone
    lgnth .556
    dia .451

    Wolf Bullets (Canada)
    230gr
    LRN
    lgnth .660
    dia .452

    Wolf Bullets (Canada)
    200gr
    LSWC
    lngth .636
    dia .452

    Plains Ammunition Supply
    155gr
    LSWC
    lgth .566
    dia .452

  10. #20
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    Folks, we are experiencing thread drift. PLEASE do not use this thread to discuss loading, loads, cartridge lengths, etc. This thread is to compile dimension data on bullets. Please start your own thread if you wish to discuss other issues.

    For now, this thread is for .45 Auto only. If someone wants to start a parallel thread for 9mm, Super .38, or .40 S&W, please go ahead.
    Hawkmoon
    On a good day, can hit the broad side of a barn ... from the inside

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