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Thread: To All Our Windows/Firefox Members

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  1. #1
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    Exclamation To All Our Windows/Firefox Members

    Several members in recent days have been experiencing an issue when viewing the Forum, where clicking on a link takes you to a blank and endlessly loading page. If the member clicks on the Back button, however, instead of taking them back to the original page it goes "back" the page they originally intended on viewing. A couple weeks ago I started having this problem. I originally called it "jumping" as it seemed the Forum was jumping me ahead of the page I wanted to go.

    After some time looking into the issue, I discovered the problem was Java related. I had recently upgraded from Java 6 Update 7 to Update 10. This version of Java seems to have a problem with Firefox 3.x under Windows (especially Windows Vista, but on Windows XP as well). This latest version of Java will cause a little-documented feature of Firefox called WYCIWYG (What You Cache Is What You Get) to become active when viewing pages on M1911.ORG. You can see this when you get to one of these infinite blank screens and clicking on the little down arrow to the right of the Forward button (it's called the Recent Pages function). You'll see that the latest page accessed starts with wyciwyg:// followed by the web URL to the page on this Forum.

    When it was just me having this problem I posted about it and how I fixed it. But at the time no one else had the problem so I didn't go any further. But now I've come across two other members having the same issue. So with John's permission, I'm making this post to help our members who may experience the same problem.

    If you are having this WYCIWYG or "jumping" problem, here is what you need to do:

    1. Close all instances of Firefox, including our SMS Watcher window if you use that feature.

    2. Go into Add/Remove Programs. Find and remove ALL instances of Java (there will usually be more than one).

    3. Go into My Computer. Browse your hard drive. Go to the x:\Program Files\Java directory and delete the entire folder.

    4. Restart your computer.

    5. Open Firefox and go to the Archive: Java[tm] Technology Products Download web page. Go down six items to JDK/JRE - 6 and in the box to the right select "6 Update 7" and click on "Go".

    6. On the next screen click on "Download JRE". Then select your platform, click on the license agreement checkbox and click "Continue".

    7. Choose the required offline file. It should be jre-6u7-windows-i586-p.exe (or jre-6u7-windows-x64.exe for 64-bit platforms). Click on the filename and the download should begin.

    8. Close Firefox. Find the file you downloaded and install it. Go with the defaults.

    Once it is installed you should be good to go. Just remember that if Java prompts you to update, choose "No". If you're really savvy, go into the Java console and disable the option to check for newer versions.

    As I said earlier, this problem started happening with Java 6 Update 10. Java has released Update 11, but that version, too, has the same issue though less often than Update 10. However, this isn't the only issue I have with these latest version of Java. My company's time recording software is Java based and it doesn't work well with Update 10 or 11, and they have recommended staying with Update 7 until further notice.

    Hopefully this post will be a benefit to our fellow members. If you have any questions regarding this procedure, feel free to post about them here. And as always, if you have a computer issue you can always open a Help Desk ticket.
    "I calculated the odds of this succeeding versus the odds I was doing something incredibly stupid, and ... I went ahead anyway." - Crow T. Robot
    Tom - Resident Computer Geek
    Have a computer or Forum question? Visit our very own M1911.ORG Help Desk and ask!

  2. #2
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    Off topic, I know, but just had to post what I use; Linux/Ubuntu 8.04 and Java 6-07-3 Ubuntu and FF.

    No problems.

    Since I have a dual boot set-up, I'll go over to XP and check it out.
    Johnny

    I miss America
    Sent from my keyboard using hunt-n-peck...
    SCIENTIA SIT POTENTIA
    Last edited by Pappy; 20th December 2008 at 11:06.


  3. #3
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    Tom, if you go to about:config, what is your setting for:

    browser.cache.check_doc_frequency
    John Caradimas SV1CEC
    The M1911 Pistols Organization
    http://www.m1911.org

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by John
    Tom, if you go to about:config, what is your setting for:

    browser.cache.check_doc_frequency
    3

    I believe that is the default value.

    Seems that Firefox 3.0.5 has been released. I may have to try it along with Java 6 Update 11 and see if I have the same troubles.

    Update: I installed Firefox 3.0.5 and upgraded to Java 6 Update 11. While I couldn't duplicate the "jumping" problem I had with Update 10, my other Java-based app still doesn't work right, so I once again "downgraded" to Java 6 Update 7 and will continue to recommend to ALL our Firefox users to do the same.
    "I calculated the odds of this succeeding versus the odds I was doing something incredibly stupid, and ... I went ahead anyway." - Crow T. Robot
    Tom - Resident Computer Geek
    Have a computer or Forum question? Visit our very own M1911.ORG Help Desk and ask!
    Last edited by Tom; 20th December 2008 at 11:13.


  5. #5
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    Set it to 1, in that way the browser is reloading the page every time it visits it.
    John Caradimas SV1CEC
    The M1911 Pistols Organization
    http://www.m1911.org

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by John
    Set it to 1, in that way the browser is reloading the page every time it visits it.
    This is from TweakGuides.com:

    Quote Originally Posted by TweakGuides.com
    browser.cache.check_doc_frequency [Integer] (3) - This setting determines how often Firefox checks the page you're viewing against the cached version it holds. By default (a value of 3), Firefox automatically checks and only reloads the page if it seems outdated; a value of 2 will never check and always load the cached version (not recommended); a value of 1 will always check for a newer version of the page; a value of 0 only checks once per session. In most cases the default is fine, however if you want to force Firefox to reload new versions of every page you visit, set this option to 1, though this will slow down browsing. Remember you can manually force reload any page at any time by pressing CTRL+F5 if you think you're viewing the outdated version.
    Emphasis added

    I don't know if we want to recommend to our members to have EVERY page reload all the time. Browsing is slow enough with the number of images and such we offer and link. By setting that option to "1", that would force Firefox to load every page - even if a member hit the "Back" button.
    "I calculated the odds of this succeeding versus the odds I was doing something incredibly stupid, and ... I went ahead anyway." - Crow T. Robot
    Tom - Resident Computer Geek
    Have a computer or Forum question? Visit our very own M1911.ORG Help Desk and ask!

  7. #7
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    Well, try it. It works fine for me, no delays in loading the page as if it loads every banners every time. I think it works on a ... session basis, in other words, as long as you have the original window (the first window in which you accessed a site) open, the various common items contained in the pages you visit do get cached or at least they are checked against the site's versions and do not get reloaded.

    If I do a Ctrl-F5, all the items in the page do reload and you can see the banners loading one at a time, but that doesn't happen with the above parameter set to 1.
    John Caradimas SV1CEC
    The M1911 Pistols Organization
    http://www.m1911.org
    Last edited by John; 21st December 2008 at 03:50.


  8. #8
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    Okay. Gimme some time to make the change to the about:config page and upgrade to Update 10 and test.

    Update: Of course. Now that I want to, I cannot recreate the problem. So even without making the change to the about:config file, I cannot get Firefox/Java to fail. Grrrr!

    I don't know if it is because of all the other tweaks I've done or managing to do something different. So I'll run with this configuration for a few days and see what happens.
    "I calculated the odds of this succeeding versus the odds I was doing something incredibly stupid, and ... I went ahead anyway." - Crow T. Robot
    Tom - Resident Computer Geek
    Have a computer or Forum question? Visit our very own M1911.ORG Help Desk and ask!
    Last edited by Tom; 22nd December 2008 at 15:41.


  9. #9
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    Well, it took a while for the conditions to be met, but even with browser.cache.check_doc_frequency set to "1", I still get the blank page problem.

    So, as it stands, I'm going back to Java 6 Update 7 and HOLDING. And I will continue to recommend all our Windows/Firefox users to do the same until further notice.
    "I calculated the odds of this succeeding versus the odds I was doing something incredibly stupid, and ... I went ahead anyway." - Crow T. Robot
    Tom - Resident Computer Geek
    Have a computer or Forum question? Visit our very own M1911.ORG Help Desk and ask!

  10. #10
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    I only have this problem on the very first forum page I visit on my day's 'session', before logging in, but not always. It seems to happen less and less, but maybe I'm just forgetting. My laptop is set to update (almost) everything as it becomes available. It doesn't happen often enough to annoy me, to be honest, and it is easily resolvable.

    The only other thing I've noticed that bugs me a little is when I take too long writing a post, and hit the 'post reply' buttom after I have timed out. I'm prompted to log in, and then another page tells me that I'm trying to make a post at an old page. I get around this by hitting the 'back' button until I'm back at the page I wrote the post in, and hit the 'post reply' button again.

    Actually, leave that last one unresolved, I need to learn to blab less anyway...
    Too many people miss the silver lining because they're expecting gold.
    M. Setter

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