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Thread: Is the .38 Super adequate as a self defense handgun?

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  1. #1
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    Is the .38 Super adequate as a self defense handgun?

    I have seen articles about the .38 Super being used in competition because the lower recoil allows the shooter to get back on target faster. This would be a good feature in a self defense handgun. However, I wonder if the cartridge is as good as a .357 magnum or a .45 ACP for self defense. Would any .38 Super users care to give their opinion?

    Thanks

    JB

  2. #2
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    High-performance loads are going to duplicate 9mm +P, and a lot of cops and others use that for carry and self-defense use. I got my Super for game use, and load only "minor" ammo for it, but if someone gifted me a few boxes of JHPs, I'd certainly consider using it as a weapon.
    "A grip safety is just another excess moving part. I have never known one to prevent an accident, and moreover, it is difficult to postulate a circumstance in which it might." Jeff Cooper

  3. #3
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    38 Super can be a pretty potent round. This is data from Winchester Super X: 38 Super/125 gr bullet @ 1240 fps yields 427 ft lbs at muzzle
    45 / 185 gr bullet @ 1000fps yields 411 ft lbs at muzzle
    The more standard 45 with a 230 gr FMJ has 850-875 fps, about 390 ft lbs at muzzle.
    So, carry either one, like I do. I comfortable with the capabilities of either. Placement is the key.

  4. #4
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    If I remember, this originally brought as a defense round; car doors and so on.
    John from 1849 Sutter's Fort. Retired to Texas.
    Family, blue steel & wood, hot biscuits, and fresh coffee.
    "Life brings sorrow and joy alike. It is what a man does with them - not what they do to him - that is the true test of his mettle." T. Roosevelt

  5. #5
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    I hope so as it's my current choice. The numbers present well and generally a bit better than 9mm + P or whatever. Same bullets, I'm kinda partial to the 124gn variety at what should be 1,200fps or better.
    Jim

  6. #6
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    Super .38, as it was originally called, was the auto pistol "answer" to .357 S&W Magnum in revolvers. This was back when revolvers were considered more reliable and regular police departments (the audience of both cartridges) were content with non-nuclear handguns (or tanks or helicopter gunships).

    .38 Super, the current name, was revived as a gun games cartridge and we all know gun games offer only a token correspondence to real world gunfight requirements.

    Both are "just 9mm" and product 9mm size holes. While energy is required to produce a wound comparing energy offers no clue to the size of the wound. Bigger wound is better and .45ACP FMJ produces larger wounds than expanded 9mm JHPs. So, no, I don't consider it a good "defensive" (or even offensive) hand gun cartridge.

    -- Chuck

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck S View Post
    Super .38, as it was originally called, was the auto pistol "answer" to .357 S&W Magnum in revolvers. This was back when revolvers were considered more reliable and regular police departments (the audience of both cartridges) were content with non-nuclear handguns (or tanks or helicopter gunships).

    .38 Super, the current name, was revived as a gun games cartridge and we all know gun games offer only a token correspondence to real world gunfight requirements.

    Both are "just 9mm" and product 9mm size holes. While energy is required to produce a wound comparing energy offers no clue to the size of the wound. Bigger wound is better and .45ACP FMJ produces larger wounds than expanded 9mm JHPs. So, no, I don't consider it a good "defensive" (or even offensive) hand gun cartridge.

    -- Chuck
    .357 magnums have been producing 9mm size holes and taking care of business just fine for a couple of generations now, there's no arguing that fact. There are several factory .38 Super loads available in the 125gr range pushing around 1350fps, nearly the equivalent of the venerable 125gr .357mag and certainly not just another 9mm. The .38 Super makes for a fine self defense cartridge, offering substantial increases in performance over standard 9mm and 9mm +P with the right ammunition.

  8. #8
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    .38 Super "can" be used as a defensive round. However, there are much better choices out there. The reason for this it that .38 Super is not a commonly chambered round, so the ammo companies make very little if any defensive ammo for it. There are quality defensive rounds available in the common calibers (9MM, 40S&W, 45ACP) from Speer, Federal, Winchester, Remington, and Corbon. In .38 Super, only Corbon is making their better JHP available.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck S
    Both are "just 9mm" and product 9mm size holes. While energy is required to produce a wound comparing energy offers no clue to the size of the wound. Bigger wound is better and .45ACP FMJ produces larger wounds than expanded 9mm JHPs. So, no, I don't consider it a good "defensive" (or even offensive) hand gun cartridge.
    Chuck you are making an apples to oranges comparison, and you are incorrect about the numbers.

    The average expanded diameter in testing for Federal HST, Speer Gold Dot, Winchester Ranger etc. 9mm JHP rounds is around .62 inch. A .45 FMJ round would be .451 inch. Ballistic testing among those same popular rounds reveals very similar wound channels. In fact most coroners and trauma surgeons will tell you if asked, that they can't tell what bullet it was unless they retrieve it.

    Now if we compare similar bullet styles, FMJ to FMJ, or JHP to JHP, then the .45ACP round has an advantage, albeit a slight one. If I had to limit myself to FMJ, then without a doubt it would be .45ACP. But modern hollowpoint ammo has come a long way since the FBI Miami shootout. It's not near the compromise it once was.
    "The 1911 was the design, given by God to us through John M. Browning, that represents the epitome of what a killing tool needs to be. It was true in 1911 and it's true now." - Col. Robert Coates commanding, U.S. Marine Corp Special Operations Command Detachment 1 (DET 1)

  9. #9
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    I would consider the shooter and his/her ability way more than the size of the cartridge.
    At least in my mind accuracy trumps ammo . . . . .
    One good hit certainly seems better to me that 4 or 5 misses, no matter what size the cartridge might be???
    But then again that is only my opinion.
    Last edited by MendoChuck; 25th November 2014 at 13:11.


  10. #10
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    Yes the 38 super is a top defense round. With JHP hitting 1400fps with 500+foot pounds of energy with some loads.A very potent round for self defense and easy to shoot. The new Hodgon CFE pistol powder in the super will send them without flash.
    Last edited by jeep; 26th November 2014 at 13:58.


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