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Thread: Discussion thread for "What happens in Vegas, stays in Vegas"

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  1. #1
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    Discussion thread for "What happens in Vegas, stays in Vegas"

    Please use this thread to discuss our "What happens in Vegas, stays in Vegas" article on the Battlefield shooting range, which is published in our E-zine.
    John Caradimas SV1CEC
    The M1911 Pistols Organization
    http://www.m1911.org

  2. #2
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    Thumbs up

    There is a page on the Battlefield Vegas Website which displays the StG 44/MP44 Sturmgewehr Click Here!

    Being able to shoot the various Full Autos is compelling, however very expensive.

    Thanks John, for a very interesting article, I will definitely go to the Battlefield on my next trip to Vegas. I have been wanting to shoot a Thompson M1A1 since I was a little boy!
    Certified NRA Instructor Pistol & Shotgun
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    "There Is No Greater High Than Defeating Armed Felons" Rich-D

  3. #3
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    Ah the Thompsons! Yes, I was in love with Sgt. Saunders Thompson in the TV series "Combat!", when I was a youngster. And I've shot one, a friend owns in Vegas, Ike, some years ago (many years ago, actually).

    And while in the SHOT Show with Ike, I got the chance to meet with a person who has written a book on these guns, I didn't get his card, but if I recall the conversation correctly, his current book is something like 3" thick. The next edition he is preparing will be double that. So if book thickness is an indication of quality, then this guy is doing an amazing work on the Thompsons.

    And in case you were wondering, those things sell for about $15,000, depending on the manufacturer and production year!!!!!
    John Caradimas SV1CEC
    The M1911 Pistols Organization
    http://www.m1911.org

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by John

    And in case you were wondering, those things sell for about $15,000, depending on the manufacturer and production year!!!!!
    $15,000, I'll have to wait till my February Pension Check arrives!

    Just Dreaming!
    Certified NRA Instructor Pistol & Shotgun
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    "There Is No Greater High Than Defeating Armed Felons" Rich-D

  5. #5
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    Ah John, you really missed out. All the Thomsons I saw in my time dressed in green, were in the hands of neighbouring Greek Navy guards... I know your time there afforded you a really important 'bonding' experience with the 1911, but it seems they kept 'the other' .45 Auto - firing gun away from you!

    Carried over from the SHOT show thread:
    Quote Originally Posted by wjkuleck
    Sorry, Spyros, the StG/MP44 had a gas-operated tilting bolt. The abortive StG45 had Vorgrimmler's lock. After WWII Vorgrimmler went to Spain where at CETME he developed the CETME roller-locked rifles, which later were returned to Germany by HK resulting in the G3. If FN had allowed license production of the FAL (G1) in Germany, the G1 would have remained the service rifle so long as 7.62x51 was the BRD's service rifle cartridge. FN didn't, and the rest is roller-locked history .

    Regards,

    Walt
    Oh no... my attempt to tease John failed miserably.

    I'm amazed, though. The way the StG/MP44 is fieldstripped is identical to the HK G3

    I could be wrong (again), but I thought 'Gewehr1' was a post-war designation for the Mauser 98K (either original or perhaps modified to 7.62x51mm form?), that the FAL was the G2 and the HK the G3...

    Also, did you know that Greece was the only country to adopt both the HK G3A3/A4 AND the FN FAL at the same time? Or is this another opportunity for me to be wrong?
    Too many people miss the silver lining because they're expecting gold.
    M. Setter
    Last edited by Spyros; 22nd January 2013 at 10:21.


  6. #6
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    Icon17

    Oh so close. I was in the Brown Water Navy, Mekong Delta and there were two Thompsons locked in the armory. After listening to my father and others (101st Airborne, WWII, ETO) lavishing praise on the effectiveness of the Thompson, I wanted to carry one, but it wasn't to be. However, the M2 was a different story.

    We also watched "Combat" in the black and white years, wasn't it Little John who carried the BAR? Good feedback on that one too.
    NRA Life Member since '67

    "Never interrupt your enemy when he's making a mistake."
    Napoleon

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spyros
    Ah John, you really missed out. All the Thomsons I saw in my time dressed in green, were in the hands of neighbouring Greek Navy guards... I know your time there afforded you a really important 'bonding' experience with the 1911, but it seems they kept 'the other' .45 Auto - firing gun away from you!

    Carried over from the SHOT show thread:
    Oh no... my attempt to tease John failed miserably.

    I'm amazed, though. The way the StG/MP44 is fieldstripped is identical to the HK G3

    I could be wrong (again), but I thought 'Gewehr1' was a post-war designation for the Mauser 98K (either original or perhaps modified to 7.62x51mm form?), that the FAL was the G2 and the HK the G3...

    Also, did you know that Greece was the only country to adopt both the HK G3A3/A4 AND the FN FAL at the same time? Or is this another opportunity for me to be wrong?
    Ah, grasshopper... the G2 was the StG 510, the G4, the ArmaLite AR-10. As for Greece, FAL in '65, G3 in '77. '77 was the year that the license was signed for mfr in Greece. So, while there was some overlap...

    Warmest regards,

    Walt
    Author, The M1911 Complete Assembly Guide,
    The M1911 Complete Owner's Guide, NEW The 10/22 Complete Owner's and Assembly Guide,
    The M14
    and M1 Garand Complete Assembly Guides
    and The AR-15 Complete Assembly and NEW Owner's Guides

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by John
    Ah the Thompsons! Yes, I was in love with Sgt. Saunders Thompson in the TV series "Combat!", when I was a youngster. And I've shot one, a friend owns in Vegas, Ike, some years ago (many years ago, actually).

    And while in the SHOT Show with Ike, I got the chance to meet with a person who has written a book on these guns, I didn't get his card, but if I recall the conversation correctly, his current book is something like 3" thick. The next edition he is preparing will be double that. So if book thickness is an indication of quality, then this guy is doing an amazing work on the Thompsons.

    And in case you were wondering, those things sell for about $15,000, depending on the manufacturer and production year!!!!!
    Could that have been Tracie Hill, my friend from the Ohio Gun Collectors' Association? Actually a Colt-made M1921 will go for more in the USD$25K range...and up. The M1928s are starting to push into 20K territory. The WWII M1 and M1A simplified versions would be in the 15K-20K range.

    The so-called "West Hurley" M1928s made by George Trast using a combination of the parts he acquired when his Numrich Arms bought out the bankrupt Auto Ordnance company, surplus WWII parts, and new-made parts, are a bit cheaper than the Savage-made WWII-era M1928s.

    Regards,

    Walt
    "A Machine Gun is a great way to turn lots of money into lots of noise!"
    Author, The M1911 Complete Assembly Guide,
    The M1911 Complete Owner's Guide, NEW The 10/22 Complete Owner's and Assembly Guide,
    The M14
    and M1 Garand Complete Assembly Guides
    and The AR-15 Complete Assembly and NEW Owner's Guides
    Last edited by wjkuleck; 22nd January 2013 at 22:06.


  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by horse 91-A1
    We also watched "Combat" in the black and white years, wasn't it Little John who carried the BAR? Good feedback on that one too.
    I think that was Kirby (or some name like that).

    Quote Originally Posted by wjkuleck
    Could that have been Tracie Hill, my friend from the Ohio Gun Collectors' Association?
    I do not know, he didn't had a card to give me, so I am not sure. I'll have to ask my buddy, who knew him. Short, a little on the fat side, with red hair, sound familiar?

    Quote Originally Posted by wjkuleck
    Actually a Colt-made M1921 will go for more in the USD$25K range...and up. The M1928s are starting to push into 20K territory. The WWII M1 and M1A simplified versions would be in the 15K-20K range.
    You are right, my buddy is a class III FFL dealer, so he told me about someone paying for a Colt-made one, in gold. Ain't those prices crazy?!?!?
    John Caradimas SV1CEC
    The M1911 Pistols Organization
    http://www.m1911.org

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by wjkuleck
    Ah, grasshopper... the G2 was the StG 510, the G4, the ArmaLite AR-10. As for Greece, FAL in '65, G3 in '77. '77 was the year that the license was signed for mfr in Greece. So, while there was some overlap...

    Warmest regards,

    Walt
    Thanks for setting me straight! I should have written that the FAL and G3 were used in Greece at the same time..! FALs were originally bought for specialized troops (our equivalent to the special forces), but sometime in the late 90s or early 00s, they swapped their FALs and the 7.62x51mm cartridge for M16A2s and M4s... but the FALs were still in pretty good condition, so they were reissued to regular troops. That's how I got to get familiar with the FALs... I'm still fond of my issued G3, but a side-by-side comparison of the two designs has an obvious winner... and the G3 ain't it!
    Too many people miss the silver lining because they're expecting gold.
    M. Setter

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