The pistols were not being shipped in numerical serial order number, but the first Colt shipped in 1945 was in the 1720000 range, and the last Colt shipped in 1944 was in the 1731000 range. Colt's records have it down to the day of shipment.
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The pistols were not being shipped in numerical serial order number, but the first Colt shipped in 1945 was in the 1720000 range, and the last Colt shipped in 1944 was in the 1731000 range. Colt's records have it down to the day of shipment.
Sorry... again those marks are just Colt factory production marks; nothing you've shown us yet was applied outside the Colt factory.Quote:
Originally Posted by lemppa
Yes I've noticed some people like to do that, but still haven't figured out why.
You'll notice I do not conceal the full serial number on pistols I post about in order that other collectors may have the full benefit of the infromation, and might even provide additional information I may not have.
With the full serial number, we often can give you all the information Colt's will provide with a $100 factory letter. Because pistols were not shipped in numerical order at that time in 1944 (as Mr. Peppers has already indicated) we cannot provide the specific date of shipment with the records we have. However, we can tell you what month, and specifically what dates the pistol might have been shipped, as well as where it was shipped from Colt's.
Should you decide to request a factory letter, Colt's will require the full serial number. There is nothing significant in the Colt factory shipping records about your pistol. It is not listed as being shipped overseas, or as a Lend-Lease... but neither are any others that were Lend-Leased at that time.
I think my post answering the question of where and when it was manufactured was somehow missed or not understood. This is from:
http://www.sightm1911.com/1911Production.htm
-and states:
24) Colt: S/N 1,609,529 to 1,743,846 = 1944
You're welcome.
This didn't cost the $100.00 Colt chatges for about the same information.
__________________
OJ:
That information is incorrect. 1945 Colt pistols started about 1,720,000 and the last of the 1944 pistols were in the 1,731,000 range according to the Colt shipping records. Maybe you didn't see the explanation by Mr. Peppers?
There now... and this didn't cost $100 either.;)
As a matter of fact, serial number 1743846 was shipped from Colt in late January of 1945.
Quote:
That information is incorrect. 1945 Colt pistols started about 1,720,000 and the last of the 1944 pistols were in the 1,731,000 range according to the Colt shipping records. Maybe you didn't see the explanation by Mr. Peppers?
Could be - I dunno but, I guess you'll have to take it up with this web site claiming to be :" 1911 .45 ACP Production Information ".
It's their idea - not mine. Could be Mr. Peppers is more of an expert but the info on the site looked pretty authoritative to me. I dunno who Mr. Peppers is and maybe need to be educated there. ;)
In addition, the serial number in question here isQuote:
The serial # is 1612xxx.
24) Colt: S/N 1,609,529 to 1,743,846 = 1944
Still looks to me like a 1944 product. Am I missing something here. I was just trying to be helpful and sure never expected to get in any debate while quoting from a web site that still looks valid to me.
In any event, as I said, I was trying to be helpful and, it appears that the info I gave was valid for the place and year of production. If it's that serious to you, so be it! :)
:D
:D :D
OJ:
Yes, you are missing something here. The 1944 serial range you have now posted 4 times in incorrect.
I don't need to take anything up with the website that has the incorrect information on it. They did not post the incorrect 1944 serial range here on this site; you did.
No one here has disputed the pistol in question is a 1944 gun. I was merely trying to explain to you that the 1944 serial range you were repeatedly posting is incorrect, because you had apparently not seen or understood the information posted by Mr. Peppers.
I'm confident Mr. Peppers' information (as does mine) came from Charles Clawson's 1991 book in which Mr. Clawson includes detailed shipping information taken directly from the Colt shipping records while he was at Colt's researching for the book.
For the last 15 years, Mr. Clawson's books have been regarded the ultimate source of correct information for Colt military and commercial 1911 style pistols. He has written a 2003 3rd Edition Collector's Guide which has the most current and accurate information available today.
You can acquire a copy of that collector's guide from a friend of mine, Karl Karash, for $37.50 postpaid shipped to your door anywhere in the USA. If you'd like a copy of the 1991 book, the cost is substantially higher.... about $750 if you can find one. Both books are out of print.
Serious to me? I'm not the one who has posted the same incorrect information 4 times. :dead_hors :) :)
The website posted has quite a few errors in it's serial numbers.
It lists Springfield 1911 production from serial number 72571 to 133186. Springfield production stopped at 127978.
It lists Colt's last serial number as 2380013. Colt production ended at serial number 2368781.
It lists Remington Rand's last serial number as 2619013. RR production ended at serial number 2465139.
It lists Ithaca's last serial number as 2693613. Ithaca production ended at serial number 2660318.
The site confuses final assigned serial numbers and actual final serial numbers, as well as procurement dates and actual shipping dates.
There are other mistakes in the website, and they have been there a long time. I feel no compulsion to try and tell the owner what he has wrong, but I do feel that incorrect information should be corrected here. I have no idea where the information came from on the quoted website, but bad information has a way of being picked up and repeated.
I think we're picking nits here - it depends on which authority you believe. I have the "GREEN STRIPE BOOK OF DATES - DATES OF MANUFACTURE - COLT SPORTING FIREARMS" as well as R. L. Wilson's book "THE COLT HERITAGE - THE OFFICIAL HISTORY OF COLT FIREARMS FROM 1836 TO THE PRESENT". In the sections for 1911 Military Models, both books list the same production serial numbers as the Colt 1911 ACP Production Information web site does.
I think also we're talking apples and oranges here - I'm talking production dates and I think you are talking shipping dates. Dosen't seem like the kind of dates that would stir up this much emotion - to me, at least. ;)
My original purpose was to answer the question asked and we seem in agreement on the year being 1944 since the serial number is well beyond the low listed and below the listing of the end of production for that year.
I don't claim to be an expert but, have been registered as a "gun collector" since 1934 (had an NFA weapon and the BATF registration form asked a reason for owning an NFA weapon) - I was eight years old. Over the years I've accumulated a fair number of different guns and a library to go with them and have been more than happy to share information requested on various forums. Prior to this experience, the questioner has always been happy to get the information and this has certainly been a very unpleasant exchange with being told I am posting incorrect information.
You have caused me to re-evaluate my readiness to share information if my personal integrity is smeared because I reported figures from reliable sources. Your authority vs mine hardly justifies concluding that you are correct and I am lying.
I am new to this forum and will certainly think twice before offering help here again.
This is my very last post on this thread - I joined to have fun and exchange information here - not to quibble about really insignificant trivial points as this has turned out.
Life's too short and I have guns to clean and get ready for the range tomorrow.
:butthead:
Sorry you feel that way.
Stating that the information you posted is incorrect is a far cry from smearing your personal integrity or calling you a liar.
Good luck at the range tomorrow.
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