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United States  Old 23rd August 2004, 21:46
mtb1bkr mtb1bkr is offline
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M1911 just purchased

I just purchased a couple of 1911s and I have a few questions about them. I am a new to this pistol. The pistol I'm trying to find out about in this forum is Marked Model of 1911. U.S. Army on the slide and the S/N on the reciever is 209693. After some researce, I have found the pistol was made in 1917, but the lists I have found have USMC next to the range of serial numbers. Is this common, US Army on the slide, but it's a Marine Corps pistol, or is it likely the pistol has slide from a different pistol? Any help and info would be greatly appreciated.

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United States  Old 23rd August 2004, 23:46
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Scott Gahimer Scott Gahimer is offline
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All the Marine Corps pistols have Army slide markings. They are identified by their serial number ranges.
Navy pistols through the 1915 production run were the only ones to have different markings. They were marked MODEL OF 1911 U.S. NAVY on the slides.

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United States  Old 24th August 2004, 19:17
mtb1bkr mtb1bkr is offline
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Thanks Scott. I was hoping that was the case. Is there anywhere I can go to find more info on this pistol, like when it was shipped and where to? I have seen some posts in this forum with that type of info, but have been unable to find anything online.

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Greece  Old 24th August 2004, 19:28
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I always learn something new, from every post Scott contributes.

Tnx Scott.

Rgds
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United States  Old 24th August 2004, 19:57
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Scott Gahimer Scott Gahimer is offline
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Your pistol was shipped June 4, 1917 in a shipment of 200 pistols. Shipped to the U.S. Marine Corps, Depot Quartermaster, Philadelphia, PA.
That info is included in Clawson's first book entitled "Colt .45 Service Pistols
Model of 1911 and 1911A1" printed 1991 and reprinted 1993.
The info was taken by Mr. Clawson directly from the Colt shipping records while doing research for his books.
The book is out of print, and has been for several years. Copies sell for $450-1000 when you can find one. A Colt factory letter would tell you the same thing, but they charge about $100 just for the letter.
The good news is you can always post on the forum and someone will help you for free. You may also private message members with sensitive info you don't want to post.
BTW, Clawson's Collector's Guide (a smaller version of the book) 3rd edition is out of print but still available. It does not contain all the detailed shipping info that the big book has, but it has all the info you'll need, and has the most current, updated info available. It sells for about $40. I suggest you find and buy one while they're available.
BTW, your pistol is considered a prize among collectors if it is all original. There weren't that many Marine Corps pistols as compared to Navy and Army shipments. Nice find. Would love to see it.
Best regards.

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United States  Old 24th August 2004, 23:31
mtb1bkr mtb1bkr is offline
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Pics of my M1911

Wow Scott, thanks for all of the info. After your original post, I was hoping for more good news. A little history about the pistol: I'm an active duty Marine. The former owner of this pistol, a retired Marine LtCol, died ~10 years ago. A few weeks back, his widow called my unit trying to seek a place to donate all of his possessions, mainly books, photos and uniforms. I went out to her place and accepted the donation, and have since forwarded it to the Marine Corps Museum in Quantico, VA. Last week, she called again saying she had come across a few pistols she wanted to get rid of as well. My CO went out and picked three pistols up, one Commercial 1911, the USMC 1911, and a 1903 Colt Officers revolver (which has been a nightmare to research.) My CO told the widow that he would attempt to sell the pistols and return the money to her. Upon hearing of the pistols, I told my CO I would be interested in buying them. We had them appraised and I purchased them, without knowing what I was actually purchasing them, and now here I am with at least one piece of history. After talking to my armorer about finding that the pistol was a Marine Corps pistol, he said it's very likely the pistol was issued to the LtCol, and he carried it until they were sadly replaced by the M9. The pistol was disassembled by my armorer, and he said it appears to be original, but I plan to have it checked out. It is in pretty good shape, the trigger and grip saftey are a bit loose, but all else is in tact. It's a bit worn on the outside, and I haven't had a chance to clean it up yet, I just got it yesterday. Here are three pics I just took of it.







Hope these work

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United States  Old 25th August 2004, 01:08
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I can't really tell too much about the specifics of the finish and markings from the photos. But, if what I am seeing is original blue finish (photos are a little dark to know for sure) I wouldn't change a thing.
I would be very careful not to alter anything if you clean it up. Don't use any steel wool (0000 or otherwise). The piece looks well-used but not abused.
I use only Clenzoil and bronze wool (if any wool is needed). It is a CLP.
Congrats on what may be a great find.
You might tell us about the bbl. markings and whether or not the final inspection is stamped before or after finish was applied. If after finish (correct), you should see some signs of bare and burnished metal there. The finish should be a brushed blue finish. Often on these pistols, the slide will show more wear and may appear slightly browned compared to the frame.

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United States  Old 25th August 2004, 07:46
mtb1bkr mtb1bkr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Gahimer
You might tell us about the bbl. markings and whether or not the final inspection is stamped before or after finish was applied. If after finish (correct), you should see some signs of bare and burnished metal there. The finish should be a brushed blue finish. Often on these pistols, the slide will show more wear and may appear slightly browned compared to the frame.


Being a New Guy to this circle, I have to say I don't know what bbl markings are. Also, where can I find the final inspection stamp? There's a stamp on the recieved just above the magazine release the has a circle with GHS, I believe inside. There is also what appears to be an A or V an the back bottom of the grip, just above the lanyard loop. I can't really tell if there is in bare meal around either of those stamps, but it still needs a good cleaning. I'm going to use CLP and a soft bristled brush to clean it. will have to try to take some better pics and post them on here if I can figure out how to get the Camera to work on closeups. Any other markings I should be looking for that might help with anything?

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United States  Old 25th August 2004, 10:36
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The barrel markings I refer to are on top of the chamber and visible through the ejection port with the slide forward. Should be an H and a P there oriented with one vertical to the other (stacked) while holding the pistol in your hand with the muzzle up in the air. If those marks aren't there, look all over the bbl. and report what markings are there, and where.
The GHS is the final acceptance stamp. It should be stamped after finish.
As you clean the pistol, you can look at a couple things. Look for some bare metal on the inside of the grip screw bushings where they were staked into place after finish. Also check where the plunger tube (above the left grip) is attached to the frame on the inside. You should also see a little bare metal there. That's probably enough to begin with. Small parts looked right from what I could see in the other photos.
Even if you don't have a macro setting on the camera, try taking it outside and get as close as you can while still getting the whole pistol in the frame. With outside light, we should be able to see a lot more.

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United States  Old 25th August 2004, 18:28
mtb1bkr mtb1bkr is offline
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Ok, The barrel marking is there right in the middle of the ejection port. I'll check for the other stuff as I disassemble it.

 



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