About three months ago, I bought a new Smith and Wesson Doug Koenig special. I have a couple other brands of 1911’s, but this is my first new S&W. I assumed that it just needed a little breaking in to work right, but 500 rounds later nothing has changed. I am hoping that one of the members of this Board can point me in the right direction with my problem, or make a suggestion of what I should tell S&W service department.

The problem is the trigger and the amount of pull required to release the hammer. About 15% of the time, primarily with the first round, the trigger does not function properly; even with the grip safety fully depressed, the hammer does not drop (no take up is felt). I have tried changing to my left-hand, released and reengaged the grip safety, checked to make sure the thumb safety is off; it makes no difference. Sometimes the hammer will drop, but only by using a force about 5 times more than normal. Sporadically after the first shot, the trigger seems to require more pressure to release the hammer than normal. All of the ammunition I shot was new 230 gr. FMJ; Winchester white box, Blazer Brass, and etc (no reloads or steel cases). The magazines are the original Smith and Wesson. The pistol has been properly lubricated. Bottom line, what good is a “Target” pistol, if the trigger pull can varies greatly between shots, to the point that you can’t hit the center of a target.

It is really difficult to replicate the problem. I recently tried troubleshooting the pistol, using plastic ammunition. I have not noticed any rub marks on the magazine. Without the magazine in place, the trigger pull seems to be the same every time. I tried using a different brand magazine, but it is hard to tell if that changes anything. One thing that did stand out is that sometimes the slide would not fully close on a new (plastic) round (starting with the slide fully closed and the hammer down, insert a new magazine with 8 rounds, pull the slide back and release; slide closes but leaves about 1/16” to 1/8” gap).

When this problem has occurred, I did not think to check if the slide was fully closed; I just dropped the magazine and cleared the chamber. Looking at the back end of the slide, with the barrel pointed down range, I did not notice it being out of battery. For some reason I remember that it was hard to engage the thumb safety.

Could the problem be as simple as the slide not closing fully, but why only part of the time? Is the trigger hard to pull because the disconnector would not have moved far enough to reengage, and the trigger stop is bottoming out against the magazine release? But why would it mainly occur only on the first round, and not on the second through eighth? Can anyone help?

sound like your trigger over travel screw might be turned in to much. it's bottoming out against the mag release. also your disconnector might be dirty or the sear spring might not be positioned correctly on the sear/disconnector. Disasemble it completly clean it, back the overtravel screw out one or two turns. adn put it back together.

I was about to suggest that you cycle some live rounds through the gun, instead of dummy rounds, to see if the gun goes into battery as normal - the plastic ones may simply be too big for the pistol's tight chamber.

However, if you regard this to be a malfunctioning pistol, this is something that's best done at the range...

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First of all, back that little screw in the trigger face a couple of turns and try again. Use real ammo as Rekladan suggested. Be observant, notice every detail and let us know.

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John Caradimas SV1CEC
The M1911 Pistols Organization
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The guys appear to have hit the nail on the head.Woodworker's pun intended

The adjustment screw in the face of the trigger is for trigger overtravel only. Many folks think that it adjusts the poundage of the trigger pull and attempt to adjust it. The screw should be turned counter clock wise in incriments until the gun operates properly.

Best of Luck!
Rich

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"There Is No Greater High Than Defeating Armed Felons" Rich-D

+1 on the overtravel screw.

I'd recommend that you turn it out 'til it's working OK, then turn it back in until it drops the hammer with minimal over travel (and no excessive force required); then back it out 1/2 turn from there, and you should be good to go.

Take care,

Rick

I will try loosening the screw and see what happens.

What I still don't understand is why about 48 of 50 shots are fine. It only seems to occur as the first round of a freshly loaded full magazine; never in the middle rounds of a magazine. I still wondering if the problem is related to the magazine, or the timing of the disconnector.

Could the grip safety lug be a smidgen too long? If the user was able to muscle the trigger through the first shot, recoil would tend to push the grip safety inward a bit more, alleviating the problem for subsequent shots.

Just a thought.

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The grip safety was my first thought as well. Perhaps the grip you are using on the gun is not depressing the grip safety sufficiently to fully disengage from the trigger bow. After the first shot, combining the effect of recoil with a tighter grip from pulling harder on the trigger, the grip safety is fully depressed and moves away from the trigger bow, and the rest of your shots are fine.

I have experienced this problem on occasion with one of my 1911s. I use a very high grip and my draw from the holster sometimes places my grip so high that I don't fully depress the grip safety.

As ShotgunKevin said, just a thought.

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OK, I need to back pedal on this one a bit. Originally, I though it was likely the Swartz FPS not engaging properly due to being out of time. However, a more careful reading of the original poster's comments makes me doubt that.

He stated that with a high regularity, the problem shot is the first round, and does not occur at any other time. An out of time FPS would more likely occur randomly throughout the magazine.

Further, I have the same question about the over-travel screw. If the problem is the over-travel, why would only occur with the first round in the gun, and not randomly throughout as well?

So I have some additional questions. Is the OP sure this is occurring always with the first round? Does it always occur with the same magazine or all different ones?

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"The 1911 was the design, given by God to us through John M. Browning, that represents the epitome of what a killing tool needs to be. It was true in 1911 and it's true now." - Col. Robert Coates commanding, U.S. Marine Corp Special Operations Command Detachment 1 (DET 1)