Slide riding low and loose in the front - how to fix?

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Originally Posted by egumpher

Nice barrel...

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...out of a friend's pre-Kahr AO 1911. It got sent to Hawkmoon for some experimenting a few years ago.

Cheers

You're right Niemi, the barrel's felt torque, if felt, would be CW. I've just noticed when shooting two 1911s one in left and right hand, the top of each tend to rotate towards each other.

Best,
Jon

Ha! yeah, I noticed that too...I was comparing O/S FPS vs. standard, shot mine with the O/S FPS, 18.5# in my right (strong) hand, no roll. My buddies standard FPS, 16# left hand, came over and smashed my left thumb against the hammer or something on mine. Ouch, that was dumb...I switched guns/hands and held them farther apart, the O/S FPS does seem to make a little difference.

I think the gun takes the path of least resistance = thumb...

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Originally Posted by Single Six

I think the gun takes the path of least resistance = thumb...

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And that may well be the answer. :appld:

Maybe it's not the twist caused by the bullet going down the barrel but the twist caused by the thumb (and which side of the gun the thumb is on) when the gun goes straight back in the hand.

I recall somebody once posted the calculated value of the rotation of a 1911 caused by the bullet. It was quite small. Probably unfeelable. (Unfeelable? :p )

Regards

All Dustcovers on standard 1911s should have relief of the top of the dustcover from the rails to the front of the dustcover, .5 to 1.0mm at the end, to compensate for the flex in the pistol under function...so...Niemi in #2 was right:
"• File down the dust cover"To prevent cracking in the future.
Barry

Even the oldest Ordnance frame blueprint I've got (last changed in 1944) shows the top of the dust cover in line with the bottom of the way/groove - with no relieving taper to avoid contact with the slide. Maybe it was purposely made that way to slightly reduce the vertical slop of the slide on the frame?

Regards

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Originally Posted by niemi24s

Even the oldest Ordnance frame blueprint I've got (last changed in 1944) shows the top of the dust cover in line with the bottom of the way/groove - with no relieving taper to avoid contact with the slide. Maybe it was purposely made that way to slightly reduce the vertical slop of the slide on the frame?

Regards

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To keep Dust out! lol How you been Niemi? Wheres the other old Gentlemen that I used to argue with? Hope he is well. How is your health?

Niemi24s:
The taper that I suggested has nothing to do with Ordnance drawing specs. It comes from high speed photography that was done by the military to see the 1911 under function. I believe the study was done at Quantico. In the film it is noticable under slow motion the flexing and torquing of the slide and the frame in returning to battery. I viewed the film at John Nowlin Sr.'s pistolsmithing course in Claremore, Oklahoma before he past away. The custom smiths I know always do a relief of some kind to prevent dust cover battering or cracking under use, especially in competition or high round count pistols. If not a taper a lowering of the top of the dust cover if you want the line to look uniform without a taper. The looseness in the front of the rails can come from the torque wearing the frame as you have been discussing. In custom builds with frame and slide fit from over size frames and slides the wear is minimized but will still occur in high round count pistols in front of the rails. Accu-railing will eliminate most of this if not all of it due to the 100% frame to slide fit initially, and as the accu-rails wear refitting with larger rails eliminates this movement from wear if it occurs.

Barry

Hello Barry:

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Originally Posted by bjg-1911

The taper that I suggested has nothing to do with Ordnance drawing specs.

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I know. Just wanted to make make sure folks didn't get the idea that a taper was specified by Army Ordnance - then get upset because their gun didn't have a taper there.

There are some interesting high speed videos of the 1911 from Virgil Tripp and http://www.kurzzeit.com/ , but found nothing about the military video you mentioned on YouTube - except a throbbing headache. Maybe it's there someplace.

Regards

Niemi24s...

I don't know if everything can be found on U-Tube. However, when I was at his Pistolsmithing course there were several people from various agencies that brought these films. We did not ask too many questions about their job description. Also, John gave many "closed courses" to various government agencies which came first and no matter how I tried to reason with him to get into the courses, short of getting on my knees and begging, it wasn't going to happen. Unfortunately he passed away before he could organize a more advanced course for students that wanted to really get into the esoteric techniques of building high end 1911s. More on the line of upping your skills for future APG membership if the student desired to go that direction. As far as I know, his son John Jr., also an APG member and highly skilled 1911'smith is not giving anymore 1911 courses.

Be well
Barry