Remington 1911A1: The more I research to more confussed I get

[Cold Rolled]

I just bought a Remington Rand and have some questions.
Here is what I do know:
The slide:
The slide is marked Remington Rand INC. and has a "P" up by the rear sight. There are no other markings on the slide I can find. There is NO “United States Property” markings.
The sights are the later wide sights. The are no markings or serial number under the firing pin stop.
The frame:
The frame has a serial number of 158XXX. Which should make it a Colt 1911 made between Feb. 8, 1915 to May, 1918. But the frame has a relief cuts in the frame around the trigger. However the relief cuts are much smoother them I have seen on other 1911A1s.
Right before the S/N is a mark that is not an "X" but rather looks like two crossed swords. One supposed gun expert said they are crossed riffles but they look like swords.
Other markings:
There is NO “United States Property” markings on the frame either.
On the right side of the trigger guard there is a "U" stamped below the trigger and an upside down "L" stamped in front of the trigger. On the left side of the trigger guard opposite of the "L" is a number "6". Also on the left side on the frame right by the slide stop is the letter "A" and below the magazine release is the letter "P". I have looked high a low for other marks but cannot find any.
Misc. Parts:
All misc. parts indicate this is a Remington Rand 1911A1.
Finish:
The gun is blued both the slide and the frame. Both are evenly worn both have turned brown in spots. So I am fairly sure both have been together a long time. Neither the frame nor the slide have any buffing marks to indicate they have been reblued.


Here are some questions I came up with when researching this gun:

Are the crossed “swords” the "X" referred to as an arsenal rebuild renumbered 1911?
If it is a renumbered frame why is it so much lower than any other renumbered frame I have found reference to?
Were there any blued Remington 1911A1 made? I thought all were parkerized.
Why are there no “U.S. property” markings?
Has anyone heard of a 1911 being remade into a 1911A1? If so why would a Colt 1911 S/N frame be matched up with all Remington 1911A1 parts?
I feel I paid a fair price for it. But how much do you think it is worth?

I have other questions but those are the big ones. Thank you for any help.
Mark
:confused: :( :confused:

[Doran]

The X might be British crossed pennants. Is there a prefix to the serial number, like No. or something? Some frames have had the USP removed and some frames have had the finger cutouts added. Some of the frame marks you mention are 1911A1 and not 1911. I think we really need to see a picture on this one if at all possible.

[Cold Rolled]

Thanks for your quick response.
I will respond line by line.

“The X might be British crossed pennants.”
I googled several different variations of “British crossed pennants” but could not find anything. So I do not know that symbol you are referring to. I will try to post a picture. (see last answer)

“Is there a prefix to the serial number, like No. or something?”
Nope. There is the “X” symbol (not the letter X) and then a 6 digit S/N number. I believe I listed every single marking on the gun. There are not many.
“Some frames have had the USP removed……”
Neither the frame nor the slide look like any markings have been removed. And all the markings look crisp and clear so I do not believe this gun has be buffed out for refinsh.
“….and some frames have had the finger cutouts added.”
That I what I thought when I first saw the frame. Because the cutouts are very smooth.
“Some of the frame marks you mention are 1911A1 and not 1911.”
Yes I would have to agree. But it does not seem to have enough marks.
“I think we really need to see a picture on this one if at all possible.”
I believe I can take some O.K. close up pictures with my digital camera. But I do not know how to post pictures. If anyone can let me know how I will try. I will also look for instructions posted on the site.
Thanks again for anyone's help.
Mark

[jacobtowne]

"The slide is marked Remington Rand INC. and has a "P" up by the rear sight. There are no other markings on the slide I can find. There is NO “United States Property” markings.
The sights are the later wide sights. The are no markings or serial number under the firing pin stop."

Here's a bit of help. The property stamp is not on the slide, only on the frame. The stamp on an early Colt would be on the left of the frame, forward of the trigger guard.
Crossed pennants are a British military proof mark, and were used on some Colt .45 pistols inspected in America. As far as is known, only the single tail pennant was used on these pistols, rather than the split-tailed pennant, if indeed what you have are pennants.
Have you examined this stamp with a magnifying glass?
JT

[Cold Rolled]

Thanks JT for the reply.
Again I will respond line by line.
“The property stamp is not on the slide, only on the frame. The stamp on an early Colt would be on the left of the frame, forward of the trigger guard.”
I have never seen a property stamp on a slide either but during my research I found a few references that did say sometimes the slide was stamped also. So I stated that my slide was not stamped to be as detailed as possible.
Please refer to this web site http://coolgunsite.com
Quote from above website:
“United States Property: This stamp is found on the frame and slides of 1911s manufactured for and owned by the US armed forces. In most cases a gun with the property stamp will not have a "c" in the serial number.”

“Crossed pennants are a British military proof mark, and were used on some Colt .45 pistols inspected in America. As far as is known, only the single tail pennant was used on these pistols, rather than the split-tailed pennant, if indeed what you have are pennants.”
I will look very close again tonight at the gun and try get some pictures post ASAP. I do not think this is a crossed pennant marking.
“Have you examined this stamp with a magnifying glass?”
Yes but it is not a real detailed stamp. It looks like two lines that are crossed and get thicker at the very bottom. To me they look like crossed swords and the thick part is the hilt of the sword. I asked the guy who I just bought it from and someone told him the symbol is crossed cannons. I also talked to someone else and he said crossed rifles.

Thanks again for any help.
I have looked at this site’s FAQ and will try to post pictures.
Mark

[John]

Why do I get the impression that the serial number on this pistol is tempered with? The "5" is higher than the rest of the numbers, the "X" in question is inside an area of different color, while the whole area around the "X158..." is darker than the rest of the surface.

[Doran]

I believe the frame has been polished at some time. Maybe the X is two 1 stamps crossed over each other? The A may be the remains of a FJA stamp?