Questions about feeding issues

[AdventureWolf]

As I posted in the RIA forum, my first trip to the range with my Rock Island 1911 was pretty disappointing - was getting 3 point jams, premature slide lock, and failure to return to battery (extractor missing the casing lip).

I'm trying to figure out what is making it so difficult for the rounds to feed properly. The firearm was fully cleaned and lubed before being shot.

I can slow manipulate the jams. If I slow load a round and control the slide movement, it is an instant jam and what was catching up the pistol at the range. Now, when I took the slide off and slide a bullet under the extractor, the end of the casing would not mate up with the breech face, since the pressure from the extractor pushed it up about a business card's height (against the angle on the inside of the case rim)...is this normal?

As the bullet moves up, I'm trying to find all points that would hinder the movement of the round. Could a non-smooth breech face catch up the case rim and cause a jam? Could the upper inside of the chamber catch up the bullet nose and cause a jam? How rough or smooth are these places supposed to be? Is the breech face supposed to be polished? What about the feed ramp? And if not, why not? What causes the premature slide lock? (I'm left handed so there no chance of bumping it with my thumb). I got at least 3 premature slide locks and 5 ftfs out of a hundred rounds.

How about the extractor missing the case rim and causing an out-of-battery situation? That one is a little bit more difficult to conceptualize.

Any thoughts?

I'm pretty new to 1911s so go easy on me. I respect the 1911 platform but so far for me it has shown to have an extremely narrow margin for error. Some designs seem to be very forgiving whereas if 1 small thing is not quite perfect... it causes an entire operational failure.

Obviously I want this thing to work because it should :D

Please help me to understand!!!

[AdventureWolf]

I think I may have found part of the problem. When the extractor is removed and I test feeded, rounds feed fine with apparently much less restriction. When the extractor is installed, I get the same 3 point jams. It is almost like the extractor is pinching the rim due to the angle the bullet has to tip up to reach the chamber OR that due to excessive tension it is not fully allowing the rim to naturally move up as the rest of the round is moving up.

Which leads me to ask: how do you know how much tension a 1911 extractor should have? How much is too much? How much is not enough? What is a proper way to adjust tension?

[log man]

While there are several things worth commenting on, one thing at a time. Maybe two. The cartridge getting in front of the extractor is most often a mag problem, the round is coming out ahead of it by inertia when firing and by being bumped and moving forward on it's own (inertia also) out of the mag when hand cycling. The mag should be clean and free of any oil as that will cause the rounds to slip out too easily.

The slide locking open prior to empty is most likely caused by a round bumping the slide stop lug as it's advancing upward and can sometimes be identified by a copper smudge on the lug.

Okay three things, the extractor hitting the case bevel is not a contributor to smooth function and long life and if the tip can be filed back at the same angle and allow clearance you'll be ahead. While it's been said that is in spec. on this forum it doesn't enhance smooth operation as it can cause the round to catch in it's transition into the chamber.

Oh, oh new information and good stuff. The extractor tension is adjusted by increasing or decreasing the bend. There are gauges for this, but in their absence sliding a round up the breech face with the slide in hand should be held in place when lightly shook, but loose enough to fall out if shook hard. Not definitive enough for me, but for some. Once you get it right it won't interfere with chambering and will dependably extract when a mag is not in place.

LOG

[niemi24s]

There's also some extractor tuning info in our Tech Issues section: http://www.m1911.org/technic2.htm to go along with Log Man's instructions. There's also a blueprint of the extractor in the Tech Issues section under M1911 Full Blueprints.

If you've never re-bent a 1911 extractor be advised it will take a lot more effort than you probably think. It's essentially a spring, and a rather fat one at that. You've got to really apply a lot of force to it. And don't worry - unless you're built like King Kong, you won't break it.

Regards