1911 .45 - S/N 93324 (nickel)

[Charles711]

I recently acquired a 1911 (Colt: S/N 93324) from my mother's estate and I'm trying to determine the market value, since I already know the sentimental value.

Serial # is provided above, but the gun has a nickel finish. I guess I'm trying to determine if that means it's simply 'gun' value, since I can't find where Colt Nickeled any guns back then, and I'm suspecting it's an aftermarket finish.

If I can get confirmation on the finish, I'd appreciate it. If pics are needed, I'll upload when I get home.

Charles

[wjkuleck]

I recently acquired a 1911 (Colt: S/N 93324) from my mother's estate and I'm trying to determine the market value, since I already know the sentimental value.

Serial # is provided above, but the gun has a nickel finish. I guess I'm trying to determine if that means it's simply 'gun' value, since I can't find where Colt Nickeled any guns back then, and I'm suspecting it's an aftermarket finish.

If I can get confirmation on the finish, I'd appreciate it. If pics are needed, I'll upload when I get home.

Charles

Charles, if the serial number is not preceded by a "C," it is a military 1911. As such, it would have never had a nickle finish. If it were a commercial pistol, with a "C" serial number, you'd have to get a letter from the Colt Historian to validate its original nickle finish.

The finish may be chrome, because after WWII there was quite a lot of chromin' goin' on.

Regards,

Walt

[Charles711]

Thanks Walt. I was about to update that it was a US Army model, since I realized I omitted it.

I'll put up some pics when I get home if it'll help. I'd like to get some ballpark values. Guessing they'd be around the $5-600 range, but I'm fairly ignorant. If I'm close enough, let me know and I'll skip the pics.

Thanks again,

Charles

[wjkuleck]

Thanks Walt. I was about to update that it was a US Army model, since I realized I omitted it.

I'll put up some pics when I get home if it'll help. I'd like to get some ballpark values. Guessing they'd be around the $5-600 range, but I'm fairly ignorant. If I'm close enough, let me know and I'll skip the pics.

Thanks again,

Charles

Charles, pics are always welcome. Very often nickel can be removed. Then, a careful specialist artisan could reblue it. You'd probably spend $500 doing that, but the economics could work out if the pistol is original (barrel, etc.). As it stands, I wouldn't dispute your value estimate.

Regards,

Walt

[rekladan]

Pictures would be essential in helping to determine value.

[Charles711]

Walt: Thanks again - I still don't know if it's Nickel or Chrome.

Rekladan: Just figured it out. They're coming. If I put them in right...

Sorry for the fuzziness. I miss SLR's.

http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p1/kamijeanne/1.jpg
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p1/kamijeanne/2.jpg
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p1/kamijeanne/3.jpg
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p1/kamijeanne/4.jpg
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p1/kamijeanne/5.jpg
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p1/kamijeanne/6.jpg
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p1/kamijeanne/7.jpg
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p1/kamijeanne/8.jpg
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p1/kamijeanne/9.jpg
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p1/kamijeanne/10.jpg
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p1/kamijeanne/11.jpg

[Charles711]

I guess it worked. But I thought it was supposed to be links, not pics.

I can strip it for cleaning, but that's it. If you want additional pictures, please dumb down the request when referencing parts or locations - and I'd be more than happy to oblige. This includes getting less fuzzy pictures if necessary. I appreciate any feedback and help. I won't be home for 3 hrs... gotta love commuting.

Regards,

Charles

[rekladan]

This made me sit up...

This gun has been modified beyond the finish. However, I would hazard a guess that these mods were made a loooong time ago.

The thumb safety is non-standard, but it doesn't look aftermarket, it looks to me like a GI safety with a (nicely?) welded-up thumbshelf.

The slide release looks a bit odd too, but the pictures are a bit too fuzzy to tell for sure.

It would be interesting to see if the serial on the slide matches that of the frame.

The Cavalry will, I'm sure chime in with more information, but, at the risk of rushing to conclusions (i.e. before the slide's serial), I would say that the value of the gun is, first and foremost, the sentimental one that it holds with you. It certainly looks like a previous owner of this gun really spend a lot of time with/on it.

[Charles711]

Walt: Well, I looked for a serial # in what I consider the slide (the part that slide back when a round is discharged) and could not find anything on the inside or outside. Please be more specific on where to look if you think one may exist elsewhere - otherwise it doesn't.

Here are a few more pics disassembled. Perhaps the 'blackened' areas may give an indication of the finish type - or quality of.

Charles

http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p1/kamijeanne/DSC00542.jpg

What seems to appear as 'rust' in the grip - does not apppear in RL. Simply a dark residue in the base of the grooves.

http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p1/kamijeanne/DSC00536.jpg
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p1/kamijeanne/DSC00538.jpg
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p1/kamijeanne/DSC00540.jpg

[rondawg]

They didn't have serial numbers on the slides that far back, did they? If it does, it'll be under the firing pin stop plate. That's the little plate that the hammer rests against. Pull the slide back and lock it open, and take a pencil or something and push in the end of the firing pin, the part the hammer strikes. Then you can slide that plate downwards (be careful, the firing pin will want to jump out and hit you in the eye), and the serial number will be stamped around the firing pin hole.

FWIW - I think I'd leave it just like it is! Just clean it up real good and oil it. Most folks will tell you not to shoot guns that old anyway.

[bgiven]

Colt only serial numbered A1 slides from 710000 to about 1145000.

[1saxman]

Well, the argument in favor of removing the nickel and restoring it is boosted by the fact that the US Property mark and serial number are present and clear. Many times these were altered or removed when they plated the guns to protect the owners. I could see a restoration on it going up to $750, but I would still do it if it were mine. On the other shoulder sits an angel insisting that since it's a family gun that it should be left alone. Either way, it should not be fired because heat treatment in those days left a lot to be desired.

[Charles711]

Well, to be honest... I've wanted a handgun for years... but have mostly had rifles. 1902 sigle shot, hand cock .22 target guns..... 250 Savages... etc. I've been wanting a pistol for 10 years.... but could never really justify it (having been married for 10 yrs now.)

I picked up this piece from my moms estate as I mentioned. The only distinctive factor I have associated with it was... when my father mailed her the divorce papers... she hopped in the car with the gun and was driving up to shoot him when her friend (a Sacramento cop) chased her down and stopped her. I lost dad in '96, and mom 2 years ago... thus my possession of the gun(about 9 mo ago). So, while I'm excited to have a pistol... there aren't really that many family ties to it. I am still carrying baggage about mom, but that's another story and my only real tie to the gun.

I think most of the mods occurred before my mother’s possession, except maybe the finish.... and I'm not sure. So, while discussions occur about restoration... keep in mind... I'm a noob, holding his first handgun. And while I appreciate the aesthetic values of history.... all I really wanted a piece to shoot. I still haven't shot the gun. I've learned to break it down, but still don't even own a cleanig kit. So, any experience/knowledge or opinions is appreciated... since I still don't know which direction to go with it. Keep it/Sell it/Restore it.

And the only reason I'd want to sell it is because the wife can't pull back the slide on it... at least not w/o the hammer being cocked first. And then, it's still difficult for her.

I guess what I'm really looking for is information to make a determination on which way to go.... Pros & Cons...etc.

[Scott Gahimer]

Grips, hammer, trigger, barrel and recoil spring guide all appear to possibly be original to the pistol and perhaps original finish. If so, I would change anything about those parts, or any others determined to be original finish.

I'd suggest looking around for a proper thumb safety, and then consider having the plating stripped off and the pistol's blue finish restored.

The right restoration gunsmith could probably make her look pretty good.

As is...if the barrel alone is original finish, it is worth more than $300. Possibly as much as $400-500 to the right buyer. But I'm not suggesting you part the pistol out. I'm just saying I think it would be a worthwhile restoration project.

[wjkuleck]

Either way, it should not be fired because heat treatment in those days left a lot to be desired.

Hmmm...

I've been shooting my Rem-UMC frame for about fifty years now...and my Seecamp was built on a 1914 Colt frame:

http://www.fulton-armory.com/SeecampM1911_50-800.jpg

Glad I didn't know that ;) ...

Regards,

Walt

[Charles711]

They didn't have serial numbers on the slides that far back, did they? If it does, it'll be under the firing pin stop plate. That's the little plate that the hammer rests against. Pull the slide back and lock it open, and take a pencil or something and push in the end of the firing pin, the part the hammer strikes. Then you can slide that plate downwards (be careful, the firing pin will want to jump out and hit you in the eye), and the serial number will be stamped around the firing pin hole.

FWIW - I think I'd leave it just like it is! Just clean it up real good and oil it. Most folks will tell you not to shoot guns that old anyway.

Ron - I'd be afraid of going that far without a complete guide on disassemly & reassembly. I'd probably put my eye out. :)

Ok, I actually tried it... but I had to lock the slide open. I pushed the pin in, and the plate slid down.... but it seems to catch on the hammer. (w/o the pin being able to jump into my eye.) But, I don't see an special markings.

Cancel that... I just slid it down farther and removed it (and the pin). I don't see any marking on either side of the removed plate.... or underneath where the plate rested.

[Scott Gahimer]

I'm glad you confirmed the slide is not numbered, as bgiven and rondawg have already indicated the slide should not be numbered.

You've got a good project piece there. I don't generally recommend shooting the old M1911s, even though some do and never have a problem. There is not a lot of collector value with your pistol, as is, but it would make a nice representative piece, if restored.

BTW, the magazine is a later piece.

[Hawkmoon]

Hmmm...

I've been shooting my Rem-UMC frame for about fifty years now...and my Seecamp was built on a 1914 Colt frame:
It isn't the frames that crack, it's the slides.

See the sticky "Should I shoot my ...?"

To the original poster: The pistol looks like a good candidate for a restoration, if what you want is a restored M1911 to keep in the gun safe. Restoring it will NOT make it any better a candidate for shooting. If you want a 1911 to shoot ... sell this one for whatever you can get for it, and buy the best modern 1911 available for whatever this one brings in. As it sits, it appears to be largely intact and suitable for restoration. If you shoot it and break it ... you'll have a box full of parts.

[1saxman]

Hmmm...

I've been shooting my Rem-UMC frame for about fifty years now...and my Seecamp was built on a 1914 Colt frame:

http://www.fulton-armory.com/SeecampM1911_50-800.jpg

Glad I didn't know that ;) ...

Regards,

Walt

Dude; that's what all the experts say. Obviously, not every slide will crack, but some have. In fact, it is SOP to inspect any 1911 very carefully, including Magnaflux if warranted. A1s, too. They finally developed the 'hard slide' on the post-war models that continues to this day.

[OD*]

The slide release looks a bit odd too, but the pictures are a bit too fuzzy to tell for sure.
It looks like the correct pre-1924 style to me.

[rekladan]

Is it me, or is the nickel job on this gun less bright than usual? Does this mean that the pistol may have been nickeled without being buffed? Perhaps an argument in favor of restoration, if true.

[Johnny Peppers]

Not the best of photographs, but the pistol appears to have been sandblasted before being nickled. Colt did this with some of their pistols starting in the Series 70 as it is much easier to sandblast without polishing. A pistol being polished for nickel must have extra care given to keep everything flat to avoid waves in the finish.

[Axel]

It looked like it was a nice gun before the plating. Even the grips are nice.

It was not all buffed out without mercy and the markings are clear.

I like the matt nickel look better than the polished type.

For a nickel gun, it looks good.

[Johnny Peppers]

The Colt Guard or satin nickel finish had a way of looking grungy after a few years of use. Almost like the rough finish nickel trapped grease and oil. Colt also put the ugliest set of grips they ever made on the Colt Guard finished Combat Commanders.

[rekladan]

Then maybe that's what the refinish was trying to imitate? In my previous post I started writing that it almost looks like chrome, not nickel, but I changed my mind.

[tenx]

Charles711, if it were me I would keep it like your father had it and shoot it occasionally. It is not in collector condition, so enjoy what memories you can from it. If you want something that you can shoot a lot I would look for a used modern Colt rather than spend $750 on a restoration.