RECOIL SPRING GUIDE RODS, long or short?

[MCMXI]

Admittedly I tend to prefer military 1911 with short recoil spring guide rod, some people say that a long rod improves the precision of the shooting. But to what extent is that rreally true? Since I've not noticed any appreciable difference between a S&W 1911 PC with a long rod and a WILSON COMBAT CQB with a short recoil spring guide rod...

[govtmodel]

... some people say that a long rod improves the precision of the shooting. But to what extent is that really true?

Brian Zins, 9 time NRA National Pistol Champion, does not have one is his pistol. Les Baer pistols with the 1.5 inch guarantee have short guide rods.

It's a solution in search of a problem. :p

[rekladan]

Recently the supporters of FLGRs seem to focus on recoil spring longevity (ie avoiding warping). I haen't heard the accuracy argument for a while now.

Of course, the counter-argument to warping is that the short rod, combined with the plug don't allow the spring to do this anyway, unless the spring is so far gone that it's several hundred rounds past it's lifespan - and even then it's unlikely.

The one time I remember reading about recoil spring warping occuring, was in a test regarding a Browning HP conversion, where the gun's slide was shortened by 3/4 inch and, the tester wasn't paying attention when the (very reputable) gunsmith told him that the spring's life is only 300 rounds. He put about double that through the gun, until the spring warped so badly that it became impossible to work the slide.

[John]

This has been discussed a lot of times.

The FLGRs help in extraction and feeding. The extract money out of your pocket and feed them in the pockets of their manufacturers.

With that cleared, there is no way the guide rod will improve the accuracy of the pistol, except if that pistol is already way too loose. Any decent factory 1911 will gain nothing in accuracy or reliability with a FLGR.

The old argument that the guide rod makers used to stress is that a FLGR doesn't allow the spring to kink. But if you take some measurements, you will see that there is very little unsupported length of spring between the standard guide rod and the recoil spring cap, so little that the spring can't kink.

The only advantage that you may get from a FLGR made of really heavy metal is that your muzzle may rise less. How less? I do not know, I believe that weight added up front is not good, because of inertia (more weight, more inertia the pistol has so it is more difficult to move it from target to target).

Overall, stick with the short rods, they are fine.

[wichaka]

I have a LW Commander that functioned smoother with the FLGR installed. Don't know why, but it does.

Other than the ocassional gun that may do that, there's no accuracy advantage etc. with them.

So I have tried them in all my guns, and left them, in those that functioned smoother.

[John]

I've noticed that too, in some pistols. I can't say why, I guess it has to do with the way the spring enters the recoil spring cap, not everything being 100% aligned? I do not know, but the sound as the slide was racked was smoother. No functional change of course, just audible.

[AZ Husker]

Spring in backwards? I've seen it happen. That does make some noise, and scars up the rod.

[John]

I seriously doubt if Wichaka had ever inserted a spring backwards.

[AZ Husker]

Me too. It was meant to be a generic statement, sorry!

[Joni Lynn]

I've tried most of the variations and settled on the standard short plug for most of my guns.

[MCMXI]

This has been discussed a lot of times.

The FLGRs help in extraction and feeding. The extract money out of your pocket and feed them in the pockets of their manufacturers.

With that cleared, there is no way the guide rod will improve the accuracy of the pistol, except if that pistol is already way too loose. Any decent factory 1911 will gain nothing in accuracy or reliability with a FLGR.

The old argument that the guide rod makers used to stress is that a FLGR doesn't allow the spring to kink. But if you take some measurements, you will see that there is very little unsupported length of spring between the standard guide rod and the recoil spring cap, so little that the spring can't kink.

The only advantage that you may get from a FLGR made of really heavy metal is that your muzzle may rise less. How less? I do not know, I believe that weight added up front is not good, because of inertia (more weight, more inertia the pistol has so it is more difficult to move it from target to target).

Overall, stick with the short rods, they are fine.

So does anyone would think it stupid to change recoil spring cap and guide rod of a WILSON Supergrade, inserting a short rod?

[Joni Lynn]

No, it would be one of the first things I'd probably do.

[govtmodel]

So does anyone would think it stupid to change recoil spring cap and guide rod of a WILSON Supergrade, inserting a short rod?

Not stupid.

Just as there's no good reason to put one in, unless it's a self-defense pistol, I wouldn't take it out until I had the gun apart for cleaning. Then I'd ditch the FLGR. :p

[Hawkmoon]

So does anyone would think it stupid to change recoil spring cap and guide rod of a WILSON Supergrade, inserting a short rod?
Not stupid at all. I've had two pistols that arrived with FLGRs -- one a used Combat Commander, one a new full-size. The FLGRs were replaced with standard parts before I ever fired a shot through either one of them.

[MCMXI]

May I please ask a very simple question? what do you mean for a FLGR? It's the long spring rod isn't it? I've got the long guide spring rod on my Kimber, but I've not seen any accuracy improvements actually.

[Joni Lynn]

Aside from the addition of a small amount of weight in the front of the gun they usually accomplish nothing. (Unless you like the look of them.)

[John]

I've got the long guide spring rod on my Kimber, but I've not seen any accuracy improvements actually.

Did you expect to see any accuracy improvement???

[BlueSkyJaunte]

I changed all of my FLGRs to GI length, where possible.

Frankly I just find the standard plug much easier to deal with during cleaning.

[powwowell]

Spring in backwards? I've seen it happen. That does make some noise, and scars up the rod.

Which end of the recoil spring goes on the rod? What are the consequences if it is installed backwards?

[Jolly Rogers]

Closed end toward the rod and open wind goes into the recoil spring plug.
Design specs for the plug called for a punch or pierce with a flange created to capture the open end of the spring. This "tab" inside the plug could screw onto the open winding of the spring and would prevent the launch of the plug when field stripping if it got away from the user.
Joe

[dogdollar]

So does anyone would think it stupid to change recoil spring cap and guide rod of a WILSON Supergrade, inserting a short rod?

My track record of results when I fix things that aren't broken is not very good.
DD

[rdhrt]

The one thing I have found without a doubt that is essential to a given weapons accuracy is ...Practice.

[rekladan]

Hard to argue with this one!

[amd5007]

I prefer the short guide rod set up, it is more classic and easier to take down.