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NYCMedic
23rd July 2008, 17:19
I found these pictures interesting and figured that you guys would enjoy seeing them. The first is chambered in 38 Super and the second is a 45.
They are both being sold at auction. It's a shame that I don't have $50,000-$90,000 (their individual estimated sale price) or the ability to own class III items.
http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f105/AriSuss/EJB2-S-F2-H.jpg
http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f105/AriSuss/EJB2-S-F1-H.jpg
http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f105/AriSuss/EJB1-S-F2-H.jpg
http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f105/AriSuss/EJB1-S-F1-H.jpg

ambidextrous1
23rd July 2008, 18:07
John Dillinger had a gunsmith make a full auto 1911 for him back in the 1930s, but I doubt that it was as nice as these.

When robbing a bank, he emptied a magazine into the ceiling upon entering the bank, to get people's attention and ensure their obedience.

It worked.

HarleyGuy
23rd July 2008, 20:22
I remember 2 or 3 years ago, seeing a video on the net, where a 1911 Auto was converted into a full auto. In the video, using a standard 7 rd. mag, the gun came apart, and the shooter suffered somewhat severe injuries. I wonder what kind of mod's have to be made to the 1911 to avoid this? I truly don't think I would like to have a slide, or any portion thereof, imbedded in my skull... :scared:

Just curious, haven't seen this subject come up for a while now. Have also heard rumor's, that I can't verify, that people doing home-brew trigger jobs have had them go "full-auto", causing injury.

My last question would be "why?". There are many great sub-machine guns on the market, if you could own one, that would appear to me to be, much more reliable, and I would assume if you put 30 - 50 rnds down a five inch standard 1911 barrel, that it would become so hot as to be just another "spray and pray" weapon.

I'm just making an educated guess as to the last paragraph, and am more than ready to be corrected by someone more qualified than I, if I'm incorrect in my "guess".

HG.. :D

John
23rd July 2008, 22:25
A 1911 treated by a home-gunsmith who doesn't know what he is doing can easily go full-auto. That's why it is a wise precaution to test the pistol with only 2 rounds in the magazine, after such .... efforts.

As for full-auto pistols, I have fired one in my life, a Glock 18 (or something similar). I do not believe in their usefulness. Maybe one round on the target and the rest ......

groundbranch
23rd July 2008, 23:46
From time to time we demo the Glock 18 on some of our FID missions. It can be handled with the right grip, but for the most part the guns are kept on semi-auto. I say demo because after a while we got tired of doing fam fires where the entire magazine would be emptied over the berm... Pic of one of our 18's below. $50-90k is just silly.

http://www.pbase.com/1sfg/image/45292824/original.jpg

John
24th July 2008, 04:07
LoRL, I agree with you. Here is me shooting the G18 somewhere in the Nevada desert.

http://www.m1911.org/images/LasVegas/p08.jpg

Wait a sec, how many years was that? Where is my belly? I guess Lena is right saying I am growing fat........

BillyD
24th July 2008, 09:04
Just curious, haven't seen this subject come up for a while now. Have also heard rumor's, that I can't verify, that people doing home-brew trigger jobs have had them go "full-auto", causing injury.



I think I found one of those home brew trigger jobs a couple days ago. it goes something like snap,snap, baaaaaaang

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIt5y2x7aFs

BillyD

OD*
24th July 2008, 09:49
Full auto 1911;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXh3nRd1K8U&feature=related

HarleyGuy
24th July 2008, 12:06
I think I found one of those home brew trigger jobs a couple days ago. it goes something like snap,snap, baaaaaaang

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIt5y2x7aFs

BillyD

Yep, watched video, and it was exactly as I have heard, went full auto. Guy was lucky he wasn't picking slide pieces out of his skull. Also notice that he was shooting at what appeared to be a flat surface of water...double whammy, gun could kill him, ricochet kills innocent on other side of berm... :(

Go figure...

HG.. :D

Tom
24th July 2008, 14:28
I think that a gun that small and that light, shooting a round that powerful, in full auto mode, is just a dumb idea. In that video you can see the guy struggling to maintain control of his M1911. It kept bouncing up and off target. Okay, add the forward pistol grip for added control and maybe - MAYBE - it becomes something viable. But not with the traditional pistol grip alone.

Geezer59
24th July 2008, 19:01
I think I found one of those home brew trigger jobs a couple days ago. it goes something like snap,snap, baaaaaaang

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIt5y2x7aFs

BillyD
There sure wasn't enough recoil for a .45, or even a 9mm. I'm betting what is shown is some kind of .22 conversion - or, given that no flying brass is visible at any point in the video, that it's an airsoft.

RickB
24th July 2008, 19:28
Exaaaactly. ;)
It's not unusual for a 1911 to double or triple if the trigger job goes "off", or the sear spring is improperly adjusted. I had an interesting incident, where my gun let out a few "Braaaaps" because the trigger overtravel screw had backed out! Some people will remove the screw altogether, so it doesn't walk the other way and prevent the gun from firing. Some people apparently don't recognize that there is a trigger overtravel stop built into the grip safety. That's why there's a step in the nose; to allow the trigger to clear the tip, and then to stop the trigger. I have a trick grip safety on my gun, that apparently deletes the overtravel function in favor being able to remove the safety without first removing the mainspring housing. But, if the overtravel screw is backed off, the trigger just keeps on going. Some people get all bent if they have .01" of overtravel, but mine must have been gradually increasing over time, and I didn't even notice it, even in dry fire. The trigger eventually was overtraveling to the extent that the sear spring was being pushed off the disconnector, and with the disco free to float . . . It was sort of exciting until I figured it out.

rondawg
24th July 2008, 19:40
There sure wasn't enough recoil for a .45, or even a 9mm. I'm betting what is shown is some kind of .22 conversion - or, given that no flying brass is visible at any point in the video, that it's an airsoft.
Well, yeah. That's not a real gun.

HarleyGuy
24th July 2008, 21:35
Well, yeah. That's not a real gun.

I dunno....I watched a bunch of other youtube films of other people firing full-auto .45. Just kept following links showing other films. Some of them show the gun going full auto, and then slow down the film to show it in slow motion (shows the .45 brass ejecting one at a time). Recoil didn't seem to be a problem, the muzzle just rises quickly, and most were compensated...and since it doesn't take long to empty 7 rounds out of a full auto, it happens pretty quickly..shooting sub-sonic also.

If it is real, I still don't see the point, unless the point is just experimentation.
Again, there are a lot of better options for a small sub-machine gun, if you have the Class III and the money, and a WHOLE lot cheaper than the 50K - 90K that the origional post quoted that they wanted for one of them (the 1911 Auto's). With that kind of money you could buy a small aresenal of sub-machine guns, much better suited for the job, in my opinion. And I personally wouldn't want to stand behind the slide of a 1911, converted to full-auto.. :) If you're interested, just do a search of "Full Auto .45" on youtube, and you'll find quite a few of them. I was kind of suprised. Some of them looked like teenagers, certainly not old enough to get a class III, much less buy a gun..go figure...

HG.. :D

RickB
24th July 2008, 21:41
When the guy was shooting the gun with the selector switch, with a shoulder stock? That thing was jumping around like crazy. Then the clip of the gun being shot into the water, the gun didn't move a bit, and the impact in the water looked pretty weak, as well.

NYCMedic
24th July 2008, 22:03
I want to add a bit of history and explain why someone might want these/ their historical value. Apparently they were both made as prototypes for the US Army, who at the time was looking into the possibility of producing a select fire 1911 carbine. Needless to say, they were never mass-produced and there are very few prototypes in existence.

rondawg
25th July 2008, 01:28
Watch that YouTube video over and over. There's a heckuva lot more hits in the water than any 1911 will hold, the splashes are nothing like a .45 would do, there's no recoil, no sound to speak of, and watch the hammer and back of the slide too. Airsoft, IMO.

chrisp0410
25th July 2008, 08:01
Fun post here. I have quite a bit of experience with full-auto fire and can tell you that a 1911 machine pistol is a pretty useless affair. I have played with a Glock 18 twice and agree that that beast is "somewhat" controllable with the proper grip and stance. Still very few actual hits, usually the first round or two hit where you want, the rest go into the ceiling. And a 9mm Glock is a pussycat comparedto a .45 1911 in terms of recoil.

I have a Series 80 Colt .45 Gov't model with a Barsto compensated barrel. The trigger was terrible on that gun (Gunbroker special) so I shipped it to a local 'smith I hadn't worked with before for some tuning. He used the Infinity Tri-glide components with the captive ball bearing contact points but he didn't know how to properly set things up. Sure enough, after about 30 rounds on a 2lb trigger, my last three or four rounds went burp. Again, this gun was compensated. I was using my usual two-hand hold and the first round went into the group on target at 45 feet distance. The other rounds blew chunks out of the cement board ceiling at my range. Range officer Stan was not pleased!

Anyway, enjoy.

Chrisp0410

HarleyGuy
25th July 2008, 12:08
Watch that YouTube video over and over. There's a heckuva lot more hits in the water than any 1911 will hold, the splashes are nothing like a .45 would do, there's no recoil, no sound to speak of, and watch the hammer and back of the slide too. Airsoft, IMO.

Rondawg, do the search on youtube that I mentioned in an earlier post. You'll see actual footage of 45 Auto's, including veiws of the mag, and slow motion film of them cycling, where you can clearly see .45 brass ejecting. Maybe the one in the link might have been airsoft stuff, but there are a lot of clips on youtube showing legit 1911 Full-Auto's. So they are out there, just search youtube for .45 full auto, or 1911 full auto, and you should find several. You'll also see where, through a seven round mag, they aren't that hard to tame, although I doubt one could hit a target smaller than a garbage can lid, after the first round..

HG.. :D

rondawg
25th July 2008, 15:17
Rondawg, do the search on youtube that I mentioned in an earlier post. You'll see actual footage of 45 Auto's, including veiws of the mag, and slow motion film of them cycling, where you can clearly see .45 brass ejecting. Maybe the one in the link might have been airsoft stuff, but there are a lot of clips on youtube showing legit 1911 Full-Auto's. So they are out there, just search youtube for .45 full auto, or 1911 full auto, and you should find several. You'll also see where, through a seven round mag, they aren't that hard to tame, although I doubt one could hit a target smaller than a garbage can lid, after the first round..

HG.. :D
Oh, I know that. I was talking about that video in post #7 specifically. That ain't no real gun. Personally, I can't think of many things more useless than a full-auto handgun. Fun, sure, but otherwise useless. JMHO.

HarleyGuy
25th July 2008, 18:25
Personally, I can't think of many things more useless than a full-auto handgun. Fun, sure, but otherwise useless. JMHO.
Yep, agree 100%, especially useless at 50K - 90K that the ones in the origional post were asking... :D

HG.. :D

rondawg
25th July 2008, 19:19
Especially when there's f/a Glocks! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b1RvTJBdRuA

irq23
26th July 2008, 09:40
God talk about hammer bite. Those things would kill my hand without a beavertail. I have big meathooks and those guns would remove my thumb.

elijdub
26th July 2008, 19:51
I thought this one was kinda' interesting.... 298 rounds of 9mm, through a Glock 18, with 7 mag-changes (including a drum mag):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kBjUDCyDCuI&feature=related