colt trade value needed

[jim young]

I have a motorcycle that I have been offered a colt pistol for.
The seller is sending me photos and I will post as soon as I get them, but I have some preliminary questions, He told me that he received it from a woman who's husband had died, she gave it to him and it is a ww2 era park, finish colt 1911 pistol, claims it is original and comes with the holster and the former owners side cap and shoulder insignia. he had made into cufflinks. If he is correct and it is a ww2 all original pistol what would the value be? I am asking 1600 for my bike and he seems to not know much about the gun, he did not know what parker finish was. I know you can not give a for sure opinion until photos are posted but assuming he is telling it strait. thanks in advance.

[bgiven]

Jim,

You are absolutly correct about the necessity of photos.

[wichaka]

Yep, get photos....look it over in person, take it to someone who knows WW II 1911's, or use a guide to do some research.

[jim young]

http://img119.imageshack.us/img119/1061/wwii45auto001vb3.jpg

here is the first image

It looks like the officer that owned it was a col.
He had his col. insg. made into cufflinks.
http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/9269/wwii45auto006st3.jpg

http://img119.imageshack.us/img119/3122/wwii45auto005bq4.jpg

[jim young]

here are a couple of photoshttp://img119.imageshack.us/img119/8303/wwii45auto003sv4.jpg

http://img119.imageshack.us/img119/4691/wwii45auto004uk3.jpg

http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/5977/wwii45auto002jw7.jpg

[bgiven]

IMO, fair trade.... I'd go for it.

[Hawkmoon]

It does sound like a fair trade -- or even to your advantage.

The caveat in my mind would be, what do you want the pistol for? IMHO that pistol should be preserved, not shot. If you're looking for a shooter, I respectfully suggest that you buy a new pistol and leave this one for a serious collector, who will preserve it.

[OD*]

Do the deal.

[jim young]

This would be my 5th 1911, I have a colt from ww1 reblued and a rand all original a new ss colt and a 70s combat comander. So I do not need to shoot it.

[BoomerBSG]

if i'm reading proofhouse (http://proofhouse.com/colt/index.html) right its from 1943-1944.
seriously... if your not using that cycle... dont hesitate.. if its been shot before... shoot it yourself a bit and put it up.. if its never been shot... dont even think about it.. later on.. it may contribute to your retirement nest egg:)

cheers

[wichaka]

DO IT!

But if you won't do the deal, let me know and I'll trade him a motorcycle.........and I don't even have one! But I'll find one for that Colt!

[TattooPaul]

According to the Clawson big books' copies of Colt's shipping records it was shipped on either Jan. 25, Feb.2, Feb.4 or Feb 10th 1944 (shipments weren't in numerical order to expedite shipping) to the Transportation officer at Springfield Armory that sure appears at first glance to be correct and original finish. It takes a lot of detailed study to verify the small parts but this looks like a winner. I wouldn't hesitate to do the trade. A correct Colt's M1911A1 of that vintage can fetch more than $1600 easily - my advice is do it and don't think twice about it. It's a good deal for what appears to be a fine historical piece.

[JakerouB]

FYI-

I was interested in seeing what the ribbon on the hat is, and it is:

The European-African-Middle Eastern (EAME) Campaign Medal was awarded to personnel for service within the European-African-Middle Eastern Theater between 7 December 1941 and 8 November 1945 under any of the following conditions:

(1) On permanent assignment.

(2) In a passenger status or on temporary duty for 30 consecutive days or 60 days not consecutive.

(3) In active combat against the enemy and was awarded a combat decoration or furnished a certificate by the commanding general of a corps, higher unit, or independent force that he actually participated in combat.

b. The western boundary of EAME Theater is from the North Pole, south along the 75th meridian west longitude to the 77th parallel north latitude, then southeast through Davis Strait to the intersection of the 40th parallel north latitude and the 35th meridian west longitude, then south along the meridian to the 10th parallel north latitude, then southeast to the intersection of the Equator and the 20th meridian west longitude, then along the 20th meridian west longitude to the South Pole. The eastern boundary of the EAME Theater is from the North Pole south along the 60th meridian east longitude to its intersection with the east boundary of Iran, then south along the Iran boundary to the Gulf of Oman and the intersection of the 60th meridian east longitude, then south along the 60th meridian east longitude to the South Pole. The EAME Theater included Europe, European Russia, Greenland, Iceland, Africa, Iran, Iraq, and Turkey.

The thing I saw said that a bronze star is worn on the ribbon to indicate participation in certain campaigns. I wonder if 3 stars means participation in three of the designated campaigns?

Also, the ribbon is upside down on the hat (which is a weird place for a ribbon anyway).

[DVMCLD]

I would do the trade. The pistol will only appreciate in value, where as the motorcycle will only depreciate in value as time goes by.

[jim young]

I agree but I am also offered cash of 1600. I just do not want to get a gun worth less than 1600.

[lenb]

Looks like a nice gun, with some history behind it. Based on what original condition guns like this are selling for these days, you'll definitely come out on top by doing the trade. And if trends continue, it will be worth a lot more than $1600 in a few years.

Len

[jim young]

It looks like the deal is going through. I meet with the owner saturday. The gun looks like it is all original, and the value is in my mind at least 2400 with everything. The items date from 1943 era. I would guess that since they came from the mans wife that it is his gun also. What is a grouping like this worth? The seller said that one clip is marked the other is not, that there was a p on the lug of the bbl. I can not find a remington rand that is less than 1500 in this shape. I picked up a rand a few years ago and have a reblued 1911 from 1918, and a comander form the 70s. But have always had a soft spot for real colts, You know the saying if there is not a rampent horse on it its a copy. LOL

[tenx]

I think you would be wise to do the deal.

[jim young]

Could you guys give me a list of marks to look for when I tear the gun apart?
some of the marks are present on the photos, the GHD on the frame and P but should there be a serial number under the slide rear pin stop? also what marks should be on the bbl? A [P] but should there be a colt 45 auto on bbl? A [G] on the underside ofthe slide?
thanks

[OD*]

This will be a big help, Jim.

http://coolgunsite.com/pistols/1911infopage.htm

[jim young]

thanks that helps a lot. a couple of questions, this colt 43 production as far as I read it it shoudl have the colt .45 auto on the bbl, and P left lug, G would have been dropped after 42. is this correct for this year model?

[OD*]

as far as I read it it shoudl have the colt .45 auto on the bbl, and P left lug,
That would be correct, Sir. ;)

[jim young]

Just did the deal, the guns bbl was the only thing I could not see, It did have the colt 45 auto and p stamped on it also an f ahead of the lug.
On the mags, one is stamped R on the top of the lip and the other is not stamped at all that I can find. I feel good about the deal. I originaly wanted to just sell for cash my quadrunner, but when I was offered this I knew when I saw the photos that this may be a great opertunity to get a gun I would not other wise buy.
My gut feeling is that with the side cap and other items it is in the 3000$ ball park to a collector esp. if I can find the formar owners service record I think it would help also. his name was writen inside the cap. It is on the leather sweat band W/O Poling above in old ink is what looks like maybe a V then L. P under ultraviolet there is an old ink stamp that reads POLING-V some other ink stamps but can not make it out. Do you think the W/O is for warrent officer? if so it came with birds, I assume they were for col. Any ideas where to stear me to look for his service record?

[TattooPaul]

You came out on top by a bunch IMHO, from what was visible in the previous photos, and after going thru it in detail you will be able to tell just how well you actually made out. There are many very knowledgeable folks here and with the help of detailed photos showing the various proof and assy. stamps on the slide, barrel, reciever as well as all the finshes used on various parts and many small aspects that trained eyes know what to look for you will most likely find that you have indeed made a very solid deal in your favor. Even if collecting vintage Colt's is not your main goal you can always resell and get a fair bit more than what was given up for it if it pans out the way it looks like it should at first glance. It does not look like a parts gun and that means a lot in terms of it's value and desirability. Enjoy it; and I think you'll find the researching of it's details, should you persue that, to be a lot of fun as well. Congratulations on a good deal! :cool: