Reassembly from field strip

[amk]

Hi,

Gun: USGI model, all stock parts except grip.

While reassembling from a field strip I've been getting a peculiar problem.

Place the barrel on the slide, rock back the barrel link all the way back; put in the guide rod and spring. Now I place the frame inverted on to the slide, slide it in the rails and then hold the gun vertically, muzzle up.

From here it refuses to slide all the way back to the slide lock pin removal/insert position. It seems as the barrel lugs are hung up on the frame and a downward/inward push of the barrel allows it to slide back but messes up the position of the barrel link so the pin can't be inserted. I have to slide out the frame again, adjust the position of the link and then redo. Redoing this several times usually works.

I have started getting this "refusal to slide back to pin removal position" (feeling like lugs are hung up on slide) problem only recently.

Now am I doing something wrong in reassembly? I have tried and mimicked the various posted pictorial instructions and videos but same problem.

Thanks, AMK

[1911Tuner]

Sounds like you're not getting the slidestop crosspin through the hole in the link.

[amk]

No I'm not; because by the time I slide the slide back to the correct position for the pin insertion the link has moved a little and it goes horribly wrong. This is happening because I have to push down the barrel a little to get the slide to slide back to the correct position.

AMK

[1911Tuner]

The gun was functioning correctly before you disassembled it...no?

What you're describing is exactly what happens when the slidestop pin isn't through the link. The reason that you have to push the barrel down in order to move the slide rearward is because the lugs aren't disengaging from the slide...and the link and slidestop pin accomplish that disengagement. If the pin isn't through the link...the link can't pull the barrel down...and because forward part of the lower barrel lug is sitting on top of the crosspin, it can't drop unless it's forced.

When you pull the slide forward...it all comes off, even though the slidestop pin is through the frame...no?

The link isn't supposed to go "all the way back" during reassembly. It's supposed to hang vertically so that you can get the slidestop pin through the hole. You may have to use a small tool to align it correctly as you view its position through the hole in the frame.

[amk]

The gun was functioning correctly before you disassembled it...no?

Yes, it was also assembling correctly until recently. And it still functions correctly after I reassemble it.

What you're describing is exactly what happens when the slidestop pin isn't through the link. The reason that you have to push the barrel down in order to move the slide rearward is because the lugs aren't disengaging from the slide...and the link and slidestop pin accomplish that disengagement. If the pin isn't through the link...the link can't pull the barrel down...and because forward part of the lower barrel lug is sitting on top of the crosspin, it can't drop unless it's forced.

But the pin has to be inserted when the slide notch is in the correct position, and to accomplish this I have to pull the slide rearward, it doesn't go rear without pushing the barrel down and when I do that the link position goes wrong and pin can't be inserted. What do you think I am doing wrong here?

When you pull the slide forward...it all comes off, even though the slidestop pin is through the frame...no?

Yes exactly correct. The pin misses the hole in the link so when pulled forward it all comes off.

The link isn't supposed to go "all the way back" during reassembly. It's supposed to hang vertically so that you can get the slidestop pin through the hole. You may have to use a small tool to align it correctly as you view its position through the hole in the frame.

Ah, that is my first mistake. But on occassions when I have tried tohang it loose in a downward position it doesn't hang loose vertically.

I think the issue may be that the movement of the pin is slightly stuck/jarred. Using a tool would make matters very easy but everywhere I see no tools are used. Is there something wrong with the link you think?

Cheers, AMK

[1911Tuner]

But the pin has to be inserted when the slide notch is in the correct position, and to accomplish this I have to pull the slide rearward,

The pin can be inserted in through the link with the slide at any position on the frame.
In order for the slidestop to lock into position...it has to aligh wsith the takedown notch.
But on occassions when I have tried tohang it loose in a downward position it doesn't hang loose vertically.

I think the issue may be that the movement of the pin is slightly stuck/jarred. Using a tool would make matters very easy but everywhere I see no tools are used. Is there something wrong with the link you think?

The link should move freely through its range without binding. If yours doesn't do that...there's a problem.

When the gun is correctly assembled...if the slidestop pin is in a bind with the slide at any point out of battery...there's a problem.

If the gun is correctly assembled, and you have to push down on the barrel to get the slide to move backward...you probably have a short link that isn't letting the barrel drop because it's placing the slidestop crosspin into a bind between the hole and the forward radius of the lower lug.

[amk]

Ok, I'll test if my link is moving completely freely or not.

Though, when assembled it functions correctly and there doesn't seem to be any binding. Also, racking the slide motion is smooth.

While assembling I'll try and place the pin before I slide it back to the takedown notch and when that is done I will try and put the pin in.

Thanks for your prompt advice.

AMK

[log man]

amk, Tuner has really said it all,read it and reread it. The one thing I always do for ease of assembly is to partially insert the slide stop pin as soon as I see the link in the hole. Once the pin goes through the link it's easy to pull the slide back to the notch to complete the assembly. ;)

[gfavaron]

Hang in there: Tuner will tell ya how it works technically; Niemi will measure it for ya; and John will tell ya that ya shoulda bought a Commander in the first place. :-)

[msjdgman]

amk, Tuner has really said it all,read it and reread it. The one thing I always do for ease of assembly is to partially insert the slide stop pin as soon as I see the link in the hole. Once the pin goes through the link it's easy to pull the slide back to the notch to complete the assembly. ;)

+2. I do this same practice all the time. And occasionally I use a plastic dowell to align the link hole with the frame.

[Hill]

Maybe I'm not reading this: "Place the barrel on the slide, rock back the barrel link all the way back" correctly, but I always have to make sure that the link is hanging forward, like toward the muzzle, or nothing works right.

With it forward I just slide the assembled spring, barrel, bushing, and recoil rod onto the frame, watch the lugs pass by and look for the link hole. I put the pin through the link, then slide the slide forward to verify before returning to the notch and pushing the slidestop into position. Then go and close the bushing.

[John]

Place the barrel on the slide, rock back the barrel link all the way back; put in the guide rod and spring. Now I place the frame inverted on to the slide, slide it in the rails and then hold the gun vertically, muzzle up.

Wait a sec, why are you holding the gun vertically (muzzle up)???

What you should do is hold the gun horizontally, muzzle forward. In that way the link will be hanging down, where it is supposed to be, so that you can pass the slide stop shaft through the link's hole. Then you simply push the slide further back until the reassembly notch aligns with the top of the slide stop, and push the slide stop in.

The way you do it, the link is back and you can't pass the slide stop shaft through its hole.

[amk]

So I figure I have been doing it wrong these last few months. I saw a guy on You Tube doing it the way I do it. I'll try the correct way now.

AMK

[John]

That's what happens when you trust someone in youtube instead of M1911.ORG. Full instructions at our Home Page, why go elsewhere?

[amk]

That is entirely true. In my early days I used to reassemble according to the instructions on the home page, in fact I had even printed the instructions and pictures and kept it as a ready reference and things used to be fine. But I used to have some trouble inserting the pin back so I decided to see visually how the long time users do it; unfortunately I saw incorrect instructions.

AMK

[niemi24s]

One way to keep the link flipped toward the muzzle is put the frame on the slide while they're both upside down. Then rotate the gun around the barrel axis a bit more than 90° (so the grip butt is a little lower than the barrel) and tap the barrel against the VIS until the link is jiggled down far enough to receive the slide stop.

It's probably not "according to Hoyle", but it works for Mrs. Niemi's little boy!

[amk]

What is the VIS?

[1911Tuner]

What is the VIS?

Vertical Impact Surface. It's the wall forward of the barrel bed that the rear face of the lower barrel lug strikes after it disengages from the slide.

[amk]

Thank you. I think I'll get a book to get used to all these acronyms and procedures.

AMK

[niemi24s]

What is the VIS?
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p232/niemi24s/P2240001atxt.jpg

[toolman]

Good picture niemi24s!

[niemi24s]

Thanx: Probably just because the planets were aligned just right when I took it!

[Tom]

There's one less now, so that would help make it easier. :D

[niemi24s]

But my camera's software was created before Pluto was taken off the list!!

{edited: or was it Goofy?]

[amk]

Now if you would have just said the bowtie area in the first place I would have understood :-) Sometime ago I read a long explanation from an experienced member here about the bowtie cut and how it is very important to the long life of the barrel.

AMK

[1911Tuner]

Now if you would have just said the bowtie area in the first place I would have understood

Well...The bow-tie isn't the VIS, and not all pistols have the bow-tie cut. The ones that are correctly to spec don't need it. It's done mainly to insure that the barrel lug doesn't impact low on the VIS...in the event that the VIS isn't machined at a true 90 degrees... placing stresses on the barrel/lug junction.

[niemi24s]

Well...The bow-tie isn't the VIS, and not all pistols have the bow-tie cut.
So, for a gun that does have a bow-tie (the vertical surface where all the impact takes place) where is this gun's VIS? :confused:

[1911Tuner]

So, for a gun that does have a bow-tie (the vertical surface where all the impact takes place) where is this gun's VIS?

Under the bow tie.

The barrel hitting the VIS low on the lug isn't so much the issue as it is seeing that the impact isn't all or mostly on the lower part of the lug. If it contacts evenly from top to bottom...it's good. If that can't be obtained, then it's better to have it impact at the top, and not contact...or just lightly kiss the lug nearer the feet.

[amk]

I reassembled following the original instructions and held the gun in the normal down position; it took less than a minute to reinstall the whole thing together.

So much for YouTube!!!

Thanks for all the advice everyone.

AMK