Help please- safety pin hole elongation in frame on right side

[686+]

:confused: The frame in a series 80 gold cup, has an elongated hole where the safety pin protrudes on the right side. What is causing this? Is it unsafe?

[wichaka]

As long as the safety is staying in, which it should...........and you don't notice any problems - difficulties with the gun, I wouldn't worry about it.

But I would like to see a pic...........so I know what you're looking at.

[686+]

Well, the hammer is starting to turn sideways with the pin and is rubbing the slide on one side. Does not look good and I am woried that the hammer hooks will slip of the scear.

[wichaka]

So both pins are in elongated holes? The hammer pin and the safety pin?

[SMMAssociates]

Dunno about you guys, but I'd be a little leery of shooting that thing.... :eek:

How could one get that way?

I could almost understand a bad hammer face or firing pin stop eventually forcing the hammer pin to turn itself enough to cause something like this, but the safety would (I'm guessing) require a lot of force to move while engaging the hammer and to elongate that hole.

Very soft frame?

A really good gunsmith might be in order, and he probably could weld over those holes and replace them, but there are some other questions to ask first.

[stans]

The thumb safety and the hammer are on two different pins. Are both holes elongated? Are the pins malformed and out of round?

[SMMAssociates]

I was reading Kuhnhausen last night....

The little pin that ties the hammer to the hammer strut can pop loose and ride against the innards. That could turn the hammer a little, and maybe force some odd wear on the pin holes. Still no idea how the Safety hole would be damaged, but....

Just a thought....

[686+]

Here is a photo of what I am talking about. Sorry if I confused the issue by using the wrong description. The side of the hammer opposite to this one, is starting to rub on the slide, (did not show image of this).

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-5/1003334/hole1.JPG

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-5/1003334/hole2.JPG

[stans]

That would be the hammer pin and that just ain't right! Measure the pin diameter and check for roundness (or lack thereof), then measure the hole for roundness. Out of round pin is fixed by buying a new pin, out of round hole is a whole different story. You might be able to have the hammer and frame machined for an oversize pin. How old is this pistol, have you contacted Colt?

[686+]

Will contact Colt and ask, but first I wanted to get input and see if anyone has had experiance with something like this.
Not sure of the guns age, but it is a series 80 gold cup national match with an adjustable rear sight and a plastic MSH.

[wichaka]

From the pics you posted, it looks like the safety pin hole is fine..........but the hammer pin hole is a bit suspect. Check it, or have it checked out..........ASAP.

[686+]

The gun is a 1991 date of manufacture, an it is not covered by the lifetime agreement. The lady sugested I send it in, and they will tell me a quote. :(

I talked to a friend and he commented that if the hammer surface where it rides against the slide is angled, this type of hole elongation could result.

So the question now is off to Colt or should I have a local gun smith fix it and same the fed-ex charge? :(

[SMMAssociates]

686+:

I think I'd send it to Colt unless you've really got a good gunsmith handy. Drilling the hole out and putting in a larger pin probably isn't rocket science, but I'm sure there are all kinds of "fit" issues that an expert would need to know about. (Which I'm not. Just ask anybody [grin].)

Hammer face, that little tang pin I mentioned the other day, etc., or just the way it was made, I suppose.... I don't see how that hole could be cut at an angle without others being that way too - seems like they'd drill all of those holes in one "setup". OTOH, if a drill broke and somebody (QC?) noticed that wasn't quite done, he/she might have used a handy drill press (or worse) to touch it up. Wear might enlarge the error. Just ruminating.

It does look like the "error" is small enough to fix that way, but the closer to the original centerline that the new pin ends up, the better it'll be.

Colt may be in a better position to clean this one up.... Just IMHO....

[scooter]

I have seen 1911s that the safety contact area inside was no fitted right and was pushing the hammer out of align but it usually meant the safety was very difficult to engage</FONT>

[191145]

The technical fix for bad pin holes is to drill them out and weld in bushings. This requires refinishing. Realistically, the frame/gun needs to be replaced.

[Ericthenorse]

8 month old post........ :dead_hors

[SMMAssociates]

Eric:

New members sometimes read old messages - search on something or spot an interesting header. Not everybody realizes how old a thread is. :D

And, of course, once a thread pops back to life, it's going to be visible to everybody, and possibly generate more traffic.

Just the way this stuff works....

The bad safety is something I'd not thought of back when I posted last, btw. Definitely something to look at.

Regards,

[Ericthenorse]

I am a new member.... I was just looking for an excuse to use the little guy beating the horse....... :D :D :D

[SMMAssociates]

I am a new member.... I was just looking for an excuse to use the little guy beating the horse....... :D :D :DGot my vote!

Torturing the new members is a lot of fun.

I can hardly sleep with myself :D .

I've been doing "forums" for something over 22 years. I'm going to Hell.... Come to think of it, if you've met my dog, I may already be there.... :scared:

http://tinypic.com/jree14.jpg

Let's just say that when I bought a "train your dog" book, the first page said something like "If you have a Jack Russell, return this book." :eek:

Regards,

[191145]

I don't give a damn if it's eight YEARS old. If I find it and have something to add, I'll add it. We are all learning as we go, and this is how it works.

[SMMAssociates]

I don't give a damn if it's eight YEARS old. If I find it and have something to add, I'll add it. We are all learning as we go, and this is how it works.You are, of course, correct.

But I'm still sending the dog.... :D

(Your participation is appreciated! I'm just another user here.)

Regards,

[686+]

First off hats off to the man that worked on the gun. He took it and did his best to make it work with what he had at hand.
But, o.k. a big BUT:
When he called me he said that the frame would be o.k. as is and that it did not need replacing, and since the gun was out of waranty a new frame would be $275. I asked him several times is the gun would be o.k. as is and if it was safe. He reasured me it would, and that a new frame was not needed. For some stupid reason I decided not to go with a new frame, and I must say I don't like that decision.
He did a buch of work, replaced the pin on the adjustable sight, polished the ramp, tightened the slide and barrell fit, (at least it feels 1000% better), put in a new slide stop, safet lever, and looks like a new disconector. The gun feels tight, but:
the elongated hole is still there. To compensate for the hammer twisting he filed on the slide where the hammer rest against the firing pin. Not a nice look. The disconector feels loose in the frame hole, and the slide hangs up ever so slightly before going into battery.

My verdict: The tech should have convinced me to go with a new frame, and not to stick with this one and call it o.k. If this were my company I would have never done this to a gun. I mean it works and looks like it will work quite nice for a long while, but if it were my company a gun like this would get a frame replaced, even if I had to suck up some more of the cost. I am still confused why so much work would be done to this gun with this frame.

Anyway, can post some pics if anyone wants...

Final verdict: I will just save the 275 and put it towards a mill and some tooling to fix the hole myself. Or if I can sell this one and replace it with a SW1911 then I will do that.

686+