Confused

[JCP]

In Vol. 1 The Colt .45 Automatic shop manual by Jerry Kuhnhausen on page 65 Mr. Kuhnhausen states , Under (Mating Check)

(1. Place the barrel in the frame as shown in figure 92.

2. Install the crosspin in the frame, picking up the link as it would be when assembled.

3. Slowly link the barrel down , watching for rear lug contact with the frame as the barrel begins to bed.

4. If the barrel links down into frame position without lug contact, and about 1/32" of the frame's barrel bed remains between the barrel and where the frame ramp begins, the barrel, link, and frame are properly mated.)

He also says under fig.92 (the barrel must come to rest against the top of the frame with full bed contact.)

NOW!..... I thought we wanted the verticle rear surface of barrel lug to impact the frame , not the barrel impacting the bed.

What am I missing ?

[1911Tuner]

What am I missing ?

Nothing. You just found another one of Kuhnhausen's contradictions...likely the result of writing the manual from notes taken over the years...and bad editing. Kuhnhausen's texts are a little hard to follow at times, and you often have to fill in the blanks, or draw a logical conclusion as to what he meant to say instead of what he said.

I think what he meant was that...after the barrel stops on the VIS, that it should fall the remaining few thousandths of an inch...about .003 give or take a thou...and rest on the frame bed.

In any event...if the barrel hits the bed first...or at the same time that it hits the VIS...the link will stretch or break, or the lug will pull off and likely crack clear through to the chamber.

[JCP]

Thanks Tuner,

Things like this really hurts my confidence in this book.

Jack

[1911Tuner]

Kuhnhausen's manuals are excellent reference guides, as long as we have a good foundation before we use'em. For the new student...they can be almost maddening.

O course...one can become very unpopular in some circles by even suggesting that Jerry made several glaring mistakes...but I'm used to that. ;)

[Hill]

Make the word "without" in step 4 into "with" and it makes better sense.

In his Garand manual I finally sat down and read him right through as if reading a novel. After that it all made better sense to me - maybe he established a mindmeld through his text. Jerry Kuhnhausen Spock :D

[wichaka]

NOW!..... I thought we wanted the verticle rear surface of barrel lug to impact the frame , not the barrel impacting the bed.

You miss quoted the book........he never says anything about the barrel impacting the bed. He says ".......the barrel must come to rest against the top of the frame with full bed contact." There is a difference.

I think Tuner has it right though.......but I think Jerry or his editors left something out.

[JCP]

Actually I quoted him word for word.

When I said impact I was using my words and in my opinion if you do what he says do the barrel will impact the bed in the frame.

Do keep in mind , my opinion is that of an amature . I love the 1911 and enjoy working on and improving mine.

Thank all of you for your help.

[niemi24s]

. . the barrel will impact the bed in the frame.

It's simply a matter of semantics. Here's how the gun (a mid-spec USGI 1911A1) is supposed to work.

When the barrel links down after firing, it should eventually come into contact with the frame in two places - the VIS and the barrel bed.

The first contact should (must) be made at the frame's VIS. Initial contact here instantly releases the tension in the link.

The second contact will then be made at the frame's barrel bed. The barrel will then fall to the bed without putting the link into compression.

If, however, the first contact is made at the barrel bed, the tension in the link will not (and cannot)be released, and contact will never be made at the VIS - until either the link breaks (from the shock while in tension) or the feet (lower lugs) are ripped from the bottom of the barrel (if the link does not break).

I guess most of the total energy expended in stopping barrel's aftward and downward motion (due to rotation of the link around the slide stop pin) is expended at the VIS - and maybe that's why it's called the Vertical Impact Surface. After this initial contact, the barrel's not moving aftward any more and just plops down to the bed - expending its remaining kinetic energy.

Bed contact is OK as long as it doesn't happen first. If it happens first - something will eventually break.

[JCP]

Well said niemi24s, even I understood what you said.

Now If we could just get you and Tuner to write a book :D

[niemi24s]

Now If we could just get you and Tuner to write a book :D

No, not me. Thanks for the compliment, but it's undeserved.

I've learned about 99.999% of the stuff I know about the 1911 from Tuner and the many other experts who participate in this forum.

And I'm still learning! :) Cheers

[toolman]

I thought Tooner was writin' his book. :)

You are writin' that book, aren't you Tooner? :D

[1911Tuner]

No, not me. Thanks for the compliment, but it's undeserved.

You're too modest. IF...I write the book, I'd like to get you involved for some of your excellent illustrations and mechanical drawings.

[Jolly Rogers]

You're too modest. IF...I write the book, I'd like to get you involved for some of your excellent illustrations and mechanical drawings.

Man...I second that! Niemis illustrations are crystal clear. As opposed to the faded blueprints that don't copy well.
I'll buy a copy when its done!
Joe

[JCP]

I'd like to place an order for the first copy.

Might I suggest step by step instructions on tuning the 1911. Everything in the order that they need to be done.

You see , we really do have the need.

Please

[David Rose]

If one is signed, I'll buy three copies to start. The signed one to keep, and the other two to sell.

David