Pre-70 National Match Question

[ChuckS]

Just came back from the range with my "new to me" National Match. I was trying out some 185 grain LSWC reloads. I used WST and Bullseye, with powder weights from 3.6 to 4.4 grains. My tightest groups at 25 yards were the ones using 4.4 grains of Bullseye and WST. Off a rest, this pistol will keep both loads in the 10 ring of a B-8 target, as long as I do my part. These should be about 800-850 fps loads, but I since I don't have a chronograph, I can't tell for certain what the actual velocities are.

My only concern is that the slide has been machined to reduce weight. In another thread I read about not using high pressure loads in these older Colts and I want to make sure that these loads aren't falling into that category.

Anybody out there have any thoughts on if these loads will be safe for the slide in the long term?

[pa_guns]

Hi

Chrono's are under $100 these days. They are well worth the money.

Common wisdom / urban legend holds that the cut out slides were set up for 700 to 750 fps loads with 200 to 220 grain bullets. If you really are up around 850 that sounds a bit hot.

Bob

[EchoBravoKilo]

Common wisdom / urban legend holds that the cut out slides were set up for 700 to 750 fps loads with 200 to 220 grain bullets. If you really are up around 850 that sounds a bit hot.

I have a 1966 NM - what would be appropriate factory load? I was told 185 gr. SWC....

[pa_guns]

Hi

My understanding is that the cutout slide NM's were set up for shooting light weight hand loads. I don't know if anybody ever loaded factory ammo for them. If your pistol has a conventional slide, then it should be good for anything that a normal 1911 will handle.

I have not fiddled with 185's in quite a while. My guess would be that something around 4.8 grains of 231 would be about right for 700 fps. That should be more than safe in a light slide pistol.

Bob

[Joni Lynn]

I have a few of the older GCNM's and my loads are 5 grains of WW231 or HP38 with a 200 lswc. It's a nice easy load, not high pressure and accurate. I don't know if it helps or just makes me feel better but I run a Wilson Shok Buff in my old GCNM's.
The fragile slide, easy to break legend may be just that. I've never seen a broken one nor do I know anyone that had one break or truly knows anyone that did. I go with the idea of better safe than sorry. Most often I run my light target loads anyway, for warmer loads I have newer guns that are a bit easier to replace. (all my loading is within normal specs)

[EchoBravoKilo]

Thank you both. Very helpful.

[Joni Lynn]

These early GCNM guns usually exhibit a really good fit and finish and are acceptably accurate. Do notice that if you lose the bushing or recoil spring plug you'll have to replace both since they are a pair. On an older gun the roll pin holding the front of the rear sight may break, it can be replaced easily with either a roll pin or a solid one. (put a slight bend in the solid one to help prevent it from walking back out)

[tenx]

I have heard two possible reasons for the lighter slide. Adjustable sights added an ounce or two to the gun weight. The slide cut out reduced the weight to that of the government model. Second, the lighter slide coupled with a light spring allowed very light loads to operate the gun.

I have never seen or even heard a credible report of one of these slides cracking, just rumors. As long as you don't shoot a millin rounds, I still think that with a standard weight 16 lb. recoil spring and standard ball ammo you would be just fine.

[dakota1911]

And I never heard the lightened steel slide was bad, but the extra machining did cost money, and that is why it now resides in history.l

[Joni Lynn]

The 38 Midrange guns have even more machining. They don't even have the locking lugs in them, they're all cut out. (38MR is a straight blow back gun)

[pa_guns]

The 38 Midrange guns have even more machining. They don't even have the locking lugs in them, they're all cut out. (38MR is a straight blow back gun)

Hi

All that and 7001 posts as well ....

What kind of load do you shoot out of a 38 midrange? Sounds like a dangerous setup ....

Bob

[Joni Lynn]

For the last few years I've been working down my supply of factory 38 Special 148 grain full wadcutter ammo. Mostly Federal and a few other brands thrown in for variety. The guns shoot amazingly well when the correct recoil spring is used.
Some time when I'm down your way I'll drag one of the 38 midrange guns along with me, they're unique.