What would cause this kind of jam?

[kannibul]

I had one of these two jams this past weekend, while my girlfriend was shooting. I was able to clear it without having to drop the mag out (working the slide)

This was round #149 or #150 for this gun, firing Blazer Brass 230gr FMJ. It was cleaned after the first 100 rounds, which were WWB 230gr FMJ.

After the jam, I blasted through another 50 rounds of Blazer Brass w/o any trouble - firing normal, off-handed, limp off hand, limp two hands, held at a 45 left and right...I would have shot more, but my rear sight loosened up and my day was done after that.

When I got home, I removed the spring from the slide, and manually worked the slide to where it felt a bind - then snapped some pictures of it. There were two spots that had a bind to them feeding, one of them was the jam, just I don't remember if the bullet itself was visible or not - but I think it was not.

Here are the pictures - first is 65% certainty that it was this I was seeing:

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u52/kannibul/catch-point-2-side-view.jpg

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u52/kannibul/catch-point-2.jpg

This is what I think it could have been, but I'm not certain:

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u52/kannibul/catch-point-1-side-view.jpg

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u52/kannibul/catch-point-1.jpg



The firearm is a Springfield "Loaded" 1911 Stainless.

[1911Tuner]

Could be the angle...but goin' on the third photo, it looks like a 3-Point Jam. Frame ramp may be too shallow. Barrel ramp may be too far rearward in the barrel bed, with no gap...Magazine could be a player, but probably not the sole cause. A "hybrid" 7-round mag from Check-Mate may provide the cure if the feed ramp isn't too far beyond specs.

[kannibul]

Could be the angle...but goin' on the third photo, it looks like a 3-Point Jam. Frame ramp may be too shallow. Barrel ramp may be too far rearward in the barrel bed, with no gap...Magazine could be a player, but probably not the sole cause. A "hybrid" 7-round mag from Check-Mate may provide the cure if the feed ramp isn't too far beyond specs.


Thank you - what's your take on the 1st and 2nd photo?

I think 1 and 2 is what I saw, my girlfriend thinks she saw 3 and 4.


Also, I've not shot hollowpoints with it yet, just FMJ. :)

[1911Tuner]

Thank you - what's your take on the 1st and 2nd photo?

Excessive extracxtor tenison possibly...which is called excessive stem bind...but can lead to a 3-Point, but through a different mechanism. The 3-Point may lead to the 1st and 2nd photos if the bullet nose gets past the top of the barrel ramp...which most do...causing a failure to go to battery. Most often happens on the top round from slidelock. If you can push the slide into battery easily...it's probably the extractor. If you can't...it's a 3-point.

If you can induce the stoppage by hand cycling...remove the extractor and see if it gets better. If it does, start there.

[kannibul]

Excessive extracxtor tenison possibly...which is called excessive stem bind...but can lead to a 3-Point, but through a different mechanism. The 3-Point may lead to the 1st and 2nd photos if the bullet nose gets past the top of the barrel ramp...which most do...causing a failure to go to battery. Most often happens on the top round from slidelock. If you can push the slide into battery easily...it's probably the extractor. If you can't...it's a 3-point.

If you can induce the stoppage by hand cycling...remove the extractor and see if it gets better. If it does, start there.

Thank you again. Would this be something that could "break in" on it's own?

I mean, I've got one jam out of 200 rounds fired through it. It fired 50 without issue after the jam. Also, the round that jammed was either the 4th or 5th round in the magazine, out of 5 rounds loaded - the previous 3 or 4 seemed to fire without issue, but, I wasn't shooting it.

[kannibul]

Will this be something that will go away with break in and am I over-concerned with it?

[1911Tuner]

Will this be something that will go away with break in and am I over-concerned with it?

I doubt if it will correct itself, unless the cause is a bad magazine...which will require identifying the mag. Intermittent problems like this are hard to nail down sometimes.
Much rather tweak one that does it a lot than one that only does it occasionally.

[John]

Do the extractor test and let us know what you find. The test is described in the Technical Issues forum.

[carsten1911]

Hi,

i cant really tell if I am seeing it right in photo 2...its just pretty blurred.
So my question is:
Is the extractor too long and not gripping the groove between body and rim of the case but hitting the case body with the nose instead?

Carsten

[kannibul]

Hi,

i cant really tell if I am seeing it right in photo 2...its just pretty blurred.
So my question is:
Is the extractor too long and not gripping the groove between body and rim of the case but hitting the case body with the nose instead?

Carsten


Honestly, it feels like the top edge of the casing is rubbing against the breech-face, and the nose is bumping the top of the chamber.

But, it has happend only once so far. I guess I'll see if it does it any more over the course of the next 300 rounds :D

[hunterbench]

In Which thread in the technical issues forum is the "extractor test"?
Where does one acquire check-mate magazines without buying 50 of them?

[1911Tuner]

y, it feels like the top edge of the casing is rubbing against the breech-face, and the nose is bumping the top of the chamber.

That's what it's supposed to do. That's (partly) where the "Control" comes from in controlled feed.

[John]

Extractor Tuning and Installation Tips (by Bill Wilson) is the title of the article.