Colt "Kit Guns"

[Bluffton45]

Hi,
Can you advise the history of Colt "kit guns"? Recently a friend purchased a 1911 conv'd to 38 special with the barrel so stamped. The serial no seems out of range for it's apparent age. The slide has Jim Clark's engraved signature & is also engraved Model 61-5.

What was the serial no range, yrs of mfg, calibers & who were they available to?

Yrs ago I had heard Colt provided the US Army Mksmanship Unit w/ these guns in 45 ACP w/ key parts left oversize to enable armorers final fit for accuracy for the Pistol Team use.

Thanks!
Bluffton45

[dakota1911]

Pictures of said gun are always very useful.

[Truckjohn]

Hi,
The slide has Jim Clark's engraved signature & is also engraved Model 61-5.
Bluffton45

If you have not already tried, contact Clark Custom Guns.
They probably did this conversion and smithing.
They keep pretty detailed records, and can
tell you when it was done, which smith did it, etc....

If you are concerned with the history of the Colt frame,
contact the appropriate folks at Colt -- they will dig
up the relevant info for a price.

Good luck

John

[cary Chin]

There is not a lot of info on the Colt Kit Guns. Here is what I know, back in 1959 Gil Hebard and Jim Clark approached Colt to build a 1911 in 45ACP and 38 Special in kit form, some of the parts were over-size to allow accurizing of the gun. The slide, barrel lugs and hood were oversize for fitting.They were made up until 1970, reason why they were discontinued is because of liability.

The 38 Special Kit Gun serial #'s started with 00100-H and ended around 00450-H. The "H" stands for Hebard. The barrel was marked "COLT, .38 SPEC. KIT".

The 45 ACP Kit Gun serial #'s started with 00100-B and ended with 01164-B. Barrel was marked "COLT .45 ACP KIT.

Most of these guns were sold to Gil Hebard, Jim Clark and the Army Advanced Marksmanship Unit-about 50-100 at Fort Benning. Some were also sold to my teacher the late Master Gunsmith and 1948 Olympic Pistol Team Member F. Bob Chow. I was very privileged Bob took me in under his wing, taught me how to shoot and accurize 45's and 38's. He and his wife Bobbie always treated me as one of their own. Several years ago he gave me an unassembled 38 Special Kit Gun. The late Jim Clark and Bob Chow were very good friends. All the info on the Kitguns come from letters from Colt, Gil Hebard and Jim Clark.

I will try and find a photo of the gun.

Cary Chin

[azreloader]

Cary,

Welcome to the boards and thanks for sharing that with us. The biggest benefit of this forum is the accumulated knowledge of those who contribute and your unique history is a welcome addition. You must have a great sense of pride having those connections and memories!

[Bluffton45]

Cary,

Thanks for the informative note. Since my orig post a friend showed me an AMU. Were these a similiar situation? This gun appears to have been setup on an available frame prob by a military armorer.

There is much talk today about trigger & accuracy improvements however the gunsmiths you mentioned built guns capable of very light triggers & the 1.5 to 2" groups bragged about today. I have a pair of Giles guns that after many rounds retain the same good release & can be set very light & function flawlessly.
Thanks again,
Ron

[cary Chin]

Ron,

Was the gun in 38 AMU or a Camp Perry National Match made by the AMU? Good to hear about your pair of Giles guns, he was also one of the old time masters, also a good friend of Bob Chow.

Cary Chin

"CHOW" Hardball
"CHOW" Wadcutter
"CHOW" 38 Special Conversion
Colt 1911 38 Special Kit Gun
Colt GI 1911A1
Union Switch and Siginal 1911A1
1963 GI Camp Perry National Match 1911A1

[Bluffton45]

Cary,
It is an AMU.
Ron

[cary Chin]

Hi Ron,

Colt made a conversion kit in 38 AMU, which consisted of barrel, slide, barrel bushing, and magazine in the early 1960's. The slide was the same a 38 Super slide, except it marked 38 AMU. Several of the "old time gunsmiths" used the kit to make 38 Special conversions. 38 AMU brass was not as easily found as 38 Special was. When Bob Chow retired he gave me 10,000 empties and 2000 factory rounds of 38 AMU.

Cary Chin