Which barrel and tools?

[muscle]

Ive been kicking around a Caspian build and Im pretty sure I know what I want to use for smaller parts (trigger, sear,disconnector,grip safety..) but I need some help on choosing a barrel. I seen another barrel post but I didnt want to hijack to get my information.

My build will most likely be a standard 5" frame and slide from Caspian. The frame to be stainless, slide to be blue. I like the dual tone look but may decide to go full stainless. This will be for a carry application.

I would like to stay somewhere in the $150 range with a stainless barrel.

Also what tools are recommended for fitting the barrel. I already have stones, files, calipers, books. Some barrels need to be final fitted along with the bushing O.D. What about headspacing guages, lower lug cutter, barrel jig?

Im not against spending a few extra bucks on specialy tools as I doubt this will be my last build. :D

[ArmscorBA]

muscle,
If you have a Caspian Slide get a Caspian barrel, Just my 2 pennys!! ;)
Ivan

[pa_guns]

Hi

There's an amazingly detailed / blow by blow barrel fitting sticky at the top of this forum. It's a pretty good guide to the stuff you need.

If the Caspian barrel will drop into the Caspian frame without a fuss then I'd go for it.

Bob

[Knucklehead2]

Kart. The EZ-Fit can save some tooling costs, the lower lug is finished and fit with a link. Some careful measuring, filing and stoning will produce a very well fit barrel. Not stainless though, I prefer steel anyway. Mine has never shown any signs of pitting or rust and its in the raw.

[muscle]

Kart. The EZ-Fit can save some tooling costs, the lower lug is finished and fit with a link. Some careful measuring, filing and stoning will produce a very well fit barrel. Not stainless though, I prefer steel anyway. Mine has never shown any signs of pitting or rust and its in the raw.

How can I trust with a drop-in barrel such as the Kart, that their finished lower lug will fit right and that I can acheive the best engagement of the upper lugs?

[Deacon Aegis]

Muscle, my first Caspian build, that long slide of mine, used a Kart EZ fit barrel. No doubt, mine required considerable more tooling than the simplicity of the EZ fit system suggested, but I will say that at 2000 rounds, it is performing and wearing as if it were brand new. I've been exceedingly happy with my Kart barrels (I'm into three of them now) and they are a hundred times easier to install over the Bar-sto NM barrels I've also been working with, but ultimately I must admit one of the most difficult things I'm finding to be a challenge in building is fitting the barrels. It is very challenging to get right and certainly not something I find to be among the funner tasks of doing a build.

Edit: Oh and the Kart EZ fit kit is anything but a drop-in. Don't waste your time on drop in barrels, it's like putting a VW engine in a rolls-royce when doing a custom build.

[Spindly61]

Kart seems to be the current favorite out there among our forum members. I did alot of research about a month ago and didn't
hear many complaints. I ordered a Bar-Sto barrel and there is a 10 to 12 week wait. During the wait I have bought $700.00 worth of tooling and fixtures to do the barrel and lower the frame rails. I often wonder if I'm nuts for going this way. With the money I have spent I could have bought any pistol out there and not had the tooling left. I enjoy doing things myself and get satisfaction out of a job well done. It's all up to you and what you want to do.

[Spindly61]

Lug fitting kit (http://www.brownells.com/aspx/ns/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=18787&title=1911+AUTO+LUG+FITTING+KIT)

Little Cheaper (http://www.brownells.com/aspx/ns/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=7611&title=1911+AUTO+EASY+FIT+BARREL+KIT)
bottom of page.

[muscle]

I recognize Kart being an excellant product, just wish they had a stainless option.

As for tools what about headspacing guages? are they needed with an EZ fit barrel? Anything else we might be missing for needed tools?

[muscle]

And if I just had to have a stainless barrel, this (http://www.brownells.com/aspx/ns/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=1360&title=1911+AUTO+DROP-IN+MATCH+BARRELS) is what Ive been looking at to get.

waddya think?

[pinot_guy]

Muscle,

The Ed Brown barrels are a great choice - you can't go wrong with them. A couple of alternatives you may want to check into are KKM Precision and EFK Firedragon. They are both stainless and are extremely well made.

Ivan,

I was unaware that Caspian made barrels. Is this, in fact, the case?

[Knucklehead2]

Muscle, I purchased the fitting kit, in the kit are file, loose bushing for roughing in, and centering gauge for the hood.
I also purchased a 'Go gauge' for headspace. For a new barrel, I do not think you need a 'No Go' gauge. Feeler gauge and a 'Go' are enough. One thing to remember, for a real 'Match Barrel' fit, before sizing the hood, measure the upper lugs from the breach face and decide whether you want to fit them first. A longer process and technically challenging. I am a machinist so I spent some extra time to get the second and third lug close before fitting the hood. Unless you give this considerable thought you can easily mess up, having the lower lug already finished you need to only stone/file on material heavy barrel lugs in the proper direction, sketching everything first with accurate measuring tools is a must if you go this direction. The Kart will produce a good first lug fit, and good vertical engagement without considering the other two lugs. Mine has not shot in (WWB) in over seven hundred rounds. I still have about .0005 (five tenths) to go on the second and third lugs. The same amount I started with, SA Mil-Spec is harder then I thought, and the barrel looks like the day I fit it. I believe a steel barrel is superior to stainless. Read all of Tuners (and others) posts on barrel fitting before starting and you should have a 1911 worth keeping. I spent six hours fitting, not one hour like the instructions claim.

[muscle]

Pinot, I cant find any Caspian barrels on their site. Unless they are not listed there...


Knuckle thanks, very informative. Fitting a barrel seems to be highest challenge of a good build. Im hoping that the Kuhnhausen book will shed more light on the subject when it arrives.

One thing that confuses me is that most of these stainless barrels say they have been heat treated. I thought you cant heat treat stainless steel.

anyways, the purpose for a stainless barrel would be if I went with a stainless slide mainly for asthetic purposes. If I were to leave a steel barrel raw I wonder how it would look in a stainless gun?

[ArmscorBA]

muscle,
Why do want a SS Barrel?
Ivan

[pa_guns]

Hi

The thing that the stainless barrel lets you do is to put a nice long lasting polish on the barrel hood. It *might* last for a few thousand rounds more than a steel one.

Bob

[Canuck-IL]

And if I just had to have a stainless barrel, this [link to Ed Brown barrel on Brownell's] is what Ive been looking at to get. waddya think?
I don't think "Match Quality" and "drop-in" belong in the same sentence unless it's phrased "not dop-in."
/Bryan

[muscle]

muscle,
Why do want a SS Barrel?
Ivan

"the purpose for a stainless barrel would be if I went with a stainless slide mainly for asthetic purposes. If I were to leave a steel barrel raw I wonder how it would look in a stainless gun?"

http://www.edbrown.com/images/handguns/classic5.jpg http://www.edbrown.com/images/handguns/classicmuzzle2.jpg

...Or in a blued gun for that matter...

I really like the looks of a blued slide with a stainless bushing and barrel. Function is more important to me than form but I would like to have my gun cosmetically pleasing to me.

[Knucklehead2]

Muscle, you will probably not be able to tell the difference between a Kart (ground carbon steel) and a 416 SS barrel.
Karts are very shiny in the raw, 400 series SS is not the same as 300 series SS, it will surface rust and pit if you do not keep it lightly oiled, just like steel. I would post a picture but my daughter has the digital at school, sorry. Maybe someone with a camera will oblige us with a picture of a Kart barrel.
Kinda sounds like your leaning towards a SS barrel, there are many good ones to pick from, Scheuman, Bar-Sto, Nowlin and the list goes on. My suggestion, if you go SS route, stay away from drop-ins, they are hit and miss, and you do not want to miss with a custom build, Kind ruins the whole idea if you know what I mean.

[Velocette]

I used a Caspian frame & slide with the best other parts that I could find.
When it came to the barrel, I sent the frame & slide to Bar-Sto & had Irv Stone fit the barrel properly.
In a Ransome rest, with good ammunition (Rem 185 gr match swc & 3.8 gr Bullseye) I got 5 rd groups of 1.62" consistently at 50 yds. Yes that is 1 5/8' at 50 yards.
IMHO, Irv Stones barrels might be on a waiting list, but they are worth it.
If ya wanta play with the top dogs, ya gotta pay yer dues.

Roger

[pa_guns]

I I got 5 rd groups of 1.62" consistently at 50 yds. Yes that is 1 5/8' at 50 yards.

Roger

Hi

To do that off of a Ransom Rest you must have done a good job of fitting the slide to that frame. It's not all the barrel when you are running off of a Ransom Rest.

Bob

[Velocette]

I used to carry the targets that I used and "unobtrusively" allow my fellow comptitors see the groups before the matches.
I won my share when I did my job. The Pistol was and is better than I am.
I spent many hours fitting the slide / frame, but the wisest thing I ever did was to send the slide, frame to Irv Stone to have him fit his barrel to the pistol. Today, after many many thousands of rounds, the pistol still locks up tight and shoots where it looks. I believe that ya pays for what cha gets. & Irv Stones barrels are as good as it gets. (IMHO)

Roger

[pa_guns]

Hi

You will get no argument that when it comes to real shooting that barrel to slide is where it's at. The sights aren't going to move on the slide and they are what you line up to.

The Ransom Rest puts some other variables into the equation. On a 1911 I think the Ransom will shoot worse than you could. On a revolver I think it probably shoots better than you ever could.

Bob