First 1911 Purchase, need help with the Big Decision

[matt colvin]

I'm looking at several different semi-custom 1911's right now, and am having difficulty making the choice. I'd like to keep the price max around $2300.

I'll be using the gun for informal shooting, as a gun to keep on the nightstand, and also might use it as ccw from time to time.

Here are the current candidates: Ed Brown Executive Elite, Les Baer Premier II or one of the Concept models, Wilson CQB or Classic, and finally the Nighthawk Talon.

I have not yet decided which finish that I like the most, so that is why so many guns have been listed.

I want a really good gun from the factory that will not be a headache. When purchasing a gun in this price range, I expect it to be of very high quality. I also need the reassurance of good customer service in the event of a failure down the road. I understand that all the semi-custom guns are probably very good, but I'd like to know that my money was well spent on an intelligent choice. I had originally thought that a Kimber Eclipse was the gun I wanted, but after looking at several Kimbers, I decided that it would be best to save up and wait for a higher quality gun.

If anyone owns any of these specific models, or has had experience with service from these producers, please share you experiences with me.

Thank you very much,

Matt Colvin.

[Rio Vista Slim]

Matt,
Welcome to the Forum. We're glad to have you aboard, and I'm sure that you'll get further response to this thread.

If you will visit each one of the manufacturers' sections, you will read about each of the guns that you've mentioned, as well as being able to see various finishes on each of the pistols. There is a Wealth of information on this site, and as many opinions as there are members. Studying the various pros and cons will help you to make an informed decision when the time comes to buy your new pistol.

Now, to answer the $64 question!! Given your list of choices, I would go with the Nighthawk Talon.

(Other dissenting opinions to follow :) )

[Hersh]

Now, to answer the $64 question!! Given your list of choices, I would go with the Nighthawk Talon.

Matt,

As usual it's hard to add much to my buddy Steve's response! I have to agree with him on the Nighthawk because they are more like Burger King ... "you can have it you way!"

All the guns you mentioned are fine 1911s and you really couldn't make a bad choice from your short list. Good luck with the search!

Hersh

[Eager]

I want a really good gun from the factory that will not be a headache.

I'd get an STI Trojan in blued steel for $922 from Brazos:
http://www.brazoscustom.com/

Any potential problems will be fixed by Brazos or STI, and you'll end up with a real accurate, great fitting barreled, reliable 1911 for multi-purpose. and save hundreds. Get the version with the Novak's sight cut and the thicker grips (no extra charge). It's the only factory, and sub-$1,300, 1911 that I'd be comfortable with "out of the box, and appears to be an incredible deal. This would be a great gun to start with and allow losts of money left over for a great holster, belt, mags, tools, even a safe. Here's some info. on the Trojan, I like the endorsment from the Wilson dealer:

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=37438&hl=

Otherwise, I'd call Benny Hill and let him guide you on a frame, slide and whatever quality parts you decide on with his advice.
http://www.triangleshootingsports.com/

I prefer to "start from scratch" and get my own thing. But the other guns you mentioned are great too.

Another big factor is delivery time: STI Trojans can be had right away. Benny Hill who's a fast smith, needs like 4-6 months. What's the lead time for a Nighthawk or Les Baer?

[pa_guns]

Hi

If pistols that are "not a 1911's but almost" qualify for the list then I'd put the S&W 945-1 on your shopping list. If pure 1911 is the qualifier then the 945 is out.

The stuff you do for a decent target / range pistol may or may not be compatable with a ccw. The nightstand is fine and any reasonable target pistol should be right at home there.

In the price range you are looking I think I'd go for a pure range gun. If it *happens* to fit the bill for carry, then that's fine. If it does not (to big, to many sharp edges, sights not rugged enough, what ever) then there are a number of sub $700 pistols that are very well adapted to that sort of thing.

Bob

[harleydog]

Matt, I have been banging my head on what will be my next purchase. I have 2 wilsons, 1 LB and several other 1911's. Right now I would recomend a Wilson. They are great right out of the box. Never had a failure with either one. Just open theh box, load them up and have fun shooting. Another side to the story is I am looking at Nighthawk for my next purchase. I have read nothing but good about them so that may be something to think about also. Oh what a decision!

[Hawkmoon]

If pistols that are "not a 1911's but almost" qualify for the list then I'd put the S&W 945-1 on your shopping list. If pure 1911 is the qualifier then the 945 is out.
Whatever is this world coming to? Here we are, on a 1911 forum with a guy who comes asking for advice on which 1911 to buy, and Bob starts blathering about S&W 945s. GOOD GRIEF!

Bob, I am stunned speechless. We don't even have a warning category for this brand of traitorious heresy. I'll be awake for the next three nights trying to devise a torture sufficiently cruel and unusual to properly redress your insidious transgression.





[Note: Just kidding -- if you couldn't tell]

[pa_guns]

Hi

I *knew* that if I kept talking about the 945 long enough I would get a rise out of *somebody*.

I wish I was as high on the Performance Center 1911's as I am on the 945 ....

Bob

[gottripletsNC]

John is still trying to catch his breath after you make a comment suggesting buying something other than a 1911

[gottripletsNC]

well there are a couple of Springfields in that price range

TRP Professional if I had 2300 dollars to spend on a 1911

[pa_guns]

Hi

Now that you mention it there has been an alert for a guided missile launched from Greece headed towards central PA ....

I wonder where's it headed :p

Bob

[Dustoff '68]

Matt,

As usual it's hard to add much to my buddy Steve's response! I have to agree with him on the Nighthawk because they are more like Burger King ... "you can have it you way!"

All the guns you mentioned are fine 1911s and you really couldn't make a bad choice from your short list. Good luck with the search!

Hersh


...go for the real beef....try a Yo-Bo custom....I'm sure $2300.00 will get you a real one of a kind. ;)

[pa_guns]

Hi

Do you really want one $2300 pistol?

There are a *lot* of very nice combinations of pistols that add up to $2300.

When you bounce your $2300 pistol on a concrete floor how will you react? A lot depends on the answer to that question.

At least around here a high dollar pistol gets treated pretty carefully. That can be at odds with some kinds of rock and roll use. Even a $300 RIA and a $2000 custom gun gives you more things you can do.

Bob

[secinv]

I'm looking at several different semi-custom 1911's right now, and am having difficulty making the choice. I'd like to keep the price max around $2300.

I'll be using the gun for informal shooting, as a gun to keep on the nightstand, and also might use it as ccw from time to time.

Here are the current candidates: Ed Brown Executive Elite, Les Baer Premier II or one of the Concept models, Wilson CQB or Classic, and finally the Nighthawk Talon.

I have not yet decided which finish that I like the most, so that is why so many guns have been listed.

I want a really good gun from the factory that will not be a headache. When purchasing a gun in this price range, I expect it to be of very high quality. I also need the reassurance of good customer service in the event of a failure down the road. I understand that all the semi-custom guns are probably very good, but I'd like to know that my money was well spent on an intelligent choice. I had originally thought that a Kimber Eclipse was the gun I wanted, but after looking at several Kimbers, I decided that it would be best to save up and wait for a higher quality gun.

If anyone owns any of these specific models, or has had experience with service from these producers, please share you experiences with me.

Thank you very much,

Matt Colvin.
Matt, currently having a 1911 custom carry pistol being built by my gunsmith. It will cost around $2,000.00 and the slide and receiver are Caspian. I should receive the finished product in two weeks or so, and excited....:)

One good option would be to find a good gunsmith in your area and have them build you a 1911 pistol.

I wish you luck,

Stephen

[Frank]

I have a 10 year old Les Baer PII with about 30,000 rounds through it, as well as a Concept IV that's been though Gunsite with me -- and a couple of others. I have a few Nighthawks including a Talon II and a GRP -- not real high milage yet. They're all good guns.

I'd look for the one with the features that I want. Right now, I'd lean toward a Nighthawk because, they have a reputation for excellent customer service, my personal experience with their service has been very good, and you can order one pretty much any way you want it (unless you live in California).

Good luck.

DVC

[OD*]

...go for the real beef....try a Yo-Bo custom....I'm sure $2300.00 will get you a real one of a kind. ;)
Al,

Do you have a Yost gun, if so, which one or what mods does it have?

[pa_guns]

Hi

If you go the gunsmith route you can get a *very* nice pistol. A couple of things to watch:

1) Make sure you know what you want before any activity takes place. Changing things in mid build is not a good idea.

2) Understand that the schedule is often a bit soft. A three month build can turn into a six or nine month build. If that kind of thing bugs you then don't start the process.

3) Some guys are a lot better at this than others. Research your guy before you even get started. Find somebody else who has been down the road with the individual. Better yet, find a couple of somebodys. They don't all have to be 1911's, but they should be custom work.

4) Stay flexible. Sometimes stuff simply does not work out. If the model xyz trigger is on backorder forever be ready for a second choice. That's a bit odd compared to item 1, but it's reality.

5) Stay in touch with the guy. For that matter drop by every couple of weeks to see your pistol. A big part of the deal is fully understanding exactly what was done to make it yours. You don't get that with a factory job.

6) Be ready to run it back to the guy during break in. A good custom pistol starts out very tight. Keeping it tight is part of the process. A factory job starts out looser and should have fewer issues during break in. Of course the factory job will be looser when you are done.

The gunsmith route can be a lot of fun. It's also a long term commitment. It's not for everybody.

Bob

[matt colvin]

Ok, sorry for not responding for a little while, I've been very busy lately.

Wow, 16 responses, some great ideas, but hardly anyone who has alot of experience with the Brown has answered yet. Should I post in this forums too?

So, is there a reason as to why the Executive Elite idea didn't draw much attention or... I'm just confused as to the concensus on Ed Brown's. I asked the dealer that I'll probably buy from, and he said he would lean towards the Baer. He also told me about his experience with EB (He had once ordered a Kobra, and didn't find the gun satisfactory, so he sent it back. Didn't have a very good experience at all).

I really would like to keep within the common ground of the 1911's that I listed, but I'm just not that tied to any specific model (yet)... Right now I'm leaning to the Nighthawk Talon. I had also requested a catalogue from them over the weekend, and one from Wilson too.


As far as the gunsmith option, there aren't any good gunsmith's in my area, so that would work well for me at all. Thanks for that idea though.

On the issue of the expensive gun, well, I won't be dropping it ):

Again, thanks for the opinions guys, hope to recieve more as well, and then.... the big purchase!!!

[pa_guns]

Hi

As long as the price doesn't make you keep it in the closet then go for the gusto. Spending a lot of money on a keep it in the safe gun is not my idea of money well spent.

That's just me though.

Bob

[Frank]

I have an Ed Brown Kobra Carry that I like very much. About a year ago I used it in a two day defensive pistol class (about 600 rounds as I recall), and it performed very well -- accurate, shootable and completely reliable.

I don't have any experience with the Executive Elite, and that's the only other EB now available in California. It's not on my short list of guns to buy because I already have enough 5 inch 1911s.

DVC

[Eager]

Hi

As long as the price doesn't make you keep it in the closet then go for the gusto. Spending a lot of money on a keep it in the safe gun is not my idea of money well spent.


I agree. For your first you want more of a user. Something you won't mind getting scratched. Have you read about the STI Trojan. A US made series 70 for $922 with all the features of those $2,000+ guns and requires no additional work. Search for it here and you'll see the good reviews. Plus you don't have to wait many months for it. It has a simple blued finish, so you can use the **** out of it. Get it all broken in, then send it for a refinish with all the money you saved.

[pa_guns]

Hi

There are an enormous number of very good 1911 pistols out there. I don't think there really are any bad decisions you can make. A lot of it is down to I like this feature over that feature, not this feature is bad and that feature is good.

The range of choices holds over an amazing range of prices. You can find multiple manufacturers competing anywhere from below $400 to over $2200. Things were not like this 20 or 30 years ago.

Right now I'm pretty high on SW 1911's as a good "works out of the box with a lot of features" 1911 pistol. That's not to say they have all the features, or that everybody will like the features they have and don't have.

Bob

[secinv]

Hello Everyone:

I just saw the complete Caspian 1911 (Classic) government model built by my gunsmith. Now, to be parkerized and be picked up next week and go shoot... I will take pictures of it next week or a little after. The total cost was just under $2,000.00 and glad I did it. I was very impressed from what I saw yesterday afternoon. My first .45 to own.... My Browning has been my favorite and now I think the Caspian will easily replace it.

[matt colvin]

After talking to my dealer and also some people at my local range, I am now leaningtowards a Baer. Either the P2 or a Concept model. Not sure which, as they all have a certain appeal.

I will most likely opt for the Baer coat on whichever model I choose. Is there anything else that you guys would suggest? P2 or Concept???

Thanks for all the help so far.

[pa_guns]

Hi

If you are down to one brand and two models then it's time to beg, borrow or rent one. Since they are both from the same outfit the quality and support are going to be the same.

The stuff that's left is how it fits in your hand and can your eyes pick up the sights on one better than on the other. Even with the same sights on two pistols one can be easier to pick up than the other. Small differences can be important to one person and not to another.

Bob

[Dustoff '68]

Al,

Do you have a Yost gun, if so, which one or what mods does it have?
SA GI #1 Package.

[secinv]

I picked up my newly built 1911 Caspian (classic), as the way John Browning intended on Tuesday morning (8 August 2006). I went to the range on Wednesday and put 250 rounds through it and very impressed on the way this custom pistol operates. I love it, can see why Caspian is known to produce the highest quality receivers and slides. The 1911 was assembled with the best pieces available from different manufactorers.

[OD*]

SA GI #1 Package.
Now that you know how to post pictures, lets see that baby. http://forum.m1911.org/images/icons/icon14.gif

[matt colvin]

Just thought I would update:

I've finally decided on what gun I will be ordering: A Les Baer TRS, and will be having it hardchromed.

It may be a week or two before I order, but whenever I recieve the gun, I'll make sure to post pics. :)

[pa_guns]

Hi

Polished or bead blasted under the chrome?

Just wondering ...

Bob

[matt colvin]

The thunder ranch commanche that I saw in my local gun shop had brushed flats and bead-blasted rounds. The brush part wasn't too glossy for me, and I thought the sorta two-tone finish looked pretty sharp.

[pa_guns]

Hi

The combo looks good to me as well. I'm not sure I could go with a full polish job and the bead blast on the side of the slide just doesn't look right.

Bob

[matt colvin]

Gun was ordered today. My dealer said to expect between 3 and 4 months for wait time, but I'm sure it will be well worth it. I'll post pics when the gun arrives.

[pa_guns]

Hi

It never hurts to check up on how the process is going. I'd say to check roughly once a month. Sometimes you will be amazed by what you find out.

Bob

[matt colvin]

Well, two weeks down, ~14 to go, ha ha.

pa guns, what all should I ask when I call? I wouldn't mind calling about half-way, just worry about sounding like I'm checking up on them, and subsequently wasting their time. I wouldn't want to come across that way.

[pa_guns]

Hi

We have customers who call and check up on stuff they haven't even ordered yet....

I would simply call and make sure:

1) They have the gun and it's ok
2) After seeing the gun they understand what to do
3) The work is underway
4) They are still on schedule

As long as you are polite and well organized when you call it's not to much to ask. The problem comes in when you are so disorganized when you call that you take up way to much time.

Probably the biggest fear most shops have when you call is that you are going to change your mind about what you want done. As a suggestion only - don't - that's a very expensive thing to do.

Bob

[matt colvin]

Just an update, I called Baer yesterday for a progress report, and they said 3-4 weeks to go. So it should be here soon!

[dakota1911]

I have a 945, which at a little less than $2K is about the most expensive .45 ACP lead launcher I have. No, it is not a 1911; rather sort of like a high end S&W auto and a Gold Cup had a baby with the best traits of both.

I also have A Colt Special Combat Gov., which cost me about $1.3K. The point of the story is they are both 50 yard guns. I guess I could put them in my Ransom Rest and be impressed, and although they may make one small ragged hole at 25 yards from the Ransom Rest, I wish I could do the same when I hold either in my hands.

Still, the wish is there for that custom gun. Right now I like the work of Terry Boehler. His stuff looks like he is a great techy who is also an artist.

[vikz]

if i have 2300 to spare i will look for an orinal 1911 military issue during ww2...it's just me...some history there..