Newbie here : Magazine failure

[TexasDelta]

Sure is nice to find a forum on 1911's. I have a problem with my Colt Delta Elite 10mm magazine not locking the slidelock on the last shot. I have 2 of them, one is a Mec-Gar mag which is the one that doesn't work and the other is an OEM Colt that came with the gun and that one works. What is a good mag for this pistol and where can I buy it ? Is the Cobra mag a good one or not? Thanks.

[SMMAssociates]

Texas:

Welcome to the group.

Better minds than mine will hopefully be along with comment about that magazine issue. (I just ordered a couple of Mec-Gar's for my Para Tac-Four.... Help....)

I bought a couple boxes of SWC reloads a while back and found that my Commander didn't like 'em. I figured to burn them off in the Para (much different feed ramp) but happened to wander into an article about the CobraMag's.

I cheaped out and bought three upgrade kits from Tripp - about $8 each. Figured it'd be worth a try. I had about 35 of those SWC's left, and the upgraded magazines (plain old GI-style) fed 'em fine. (One early FTF - really "off" round, though.)

My own belief (haven't seen one) is that Tripp has changed the magazine feed lip angle slightly on their own magazines, so the upgrades may not be quite as good a solution, but the price was pretty good, and they come with a serious spring.

Overall, my feeling is that the "will feed anything" claim is a little too much, but the idea of raising the nose of the round by a few thousandths may be extremely useful on the range, where you don't want a misfeed to screw up a string, and I think you can trust 'em to feed ordinary self-defense loads (ball, SWC's) with acceptable reliability in the field.

The polymer follower seems to move well, and it has a metal insert to mate with the slide stop. About $22 direct, I think. I'm going to grab a couple when the VISA gets off life support.... :D

Installing the upgrade kit in a standard magazine (non-removeable floorplate) is a bear, but only because you need a tool to really shove the spring down into the tube.

[stans]

Delta Elites work really well with stock Colt mags or Metalform mags. Metalform made most, if not all, of the magazines for Colt. Your MecGar mag may have a weak magazine spring or the portion of the follower that is supposed to engage the slide stop is slipping over the slide stop tab.

[TexasDelta]

STAN, That's exactly what it's doing. Slipping over or around the slide stop tab. I just got through ordering an upgrade for this mag from Tripps or the place that sells cobra mags. The only thing that I don't like is that it's gonna be a 7 rounder instead of 8 now. Thanks for the quick replys.

[SMMAssociates]

Texas:

You should like those Tripp upgrades....

Wait until you see the follower - that's why the loss of capacity. It's LONG....

I hope they hold up as well as they look :) .

The spring they provide is very stiff - if you're using magazines with a non-removeable floorplate, the trick is to use a tool (Brownell's "extractor" tool is nice) and shove the spring as far into the magazine tube as you can. Then push it a little further :eek: and pin it. The follower will kind of upset into the tube at that point.

(Seriously, you need about 2" of free space at the top of the tube to get the follower in.)

[TexasDelta]

Thanks for the advice Stu, I sure could use it. I'm new to this. Thanks

[SMMAssociates]

Glad to help out.

Most of us were beginners once. I don't consider myself an expert by any means. Plenty of great help here. Don't forget to read some of the "notes" you can get to via the home page.

Another trick with respect to magazine springs, is to find a small screwdriver you don't like. Maybe a quarter-inch wide flat blade, 4-6" long. Use a dremel tool, a bandsaw, or a file, to cut a slot in the centerline of the blade, about an eighth of an inch deep, and a bit wider than the spring wire.

Dandy spring tool.... A thin blade will go into tight places, and should be sturdy enough to manipulate a spring easily.

Use real soft steel so you don't score the spring wire....

The Brownell's tool has a steel body about the diameter of your average "nice" ballpoint, with a short stepped "pin" on one end (for getting the firing pin out of the stop) and a longer end - about 3" long - with a little bend in it, and a step on the end for grabbing the extractor hook. Probably worth it, but a brass or steel rod (the bend helps) will do just as well for the extractor, and any old "pin" can be used to remove a firing pin. (I think Browning's intent was to use the hammer strut for stuff like this. Probably for the extractor, too.)

None of this is rocket science. John Browning appears to have designed a gun that can be used as a wheel chock if necessary, and maintained by a cook seconded to driving trucks. However, it also appears that he assumed that a good armorer and lots of parts would be available, which is why most stripdown instructions have a point at which you're advised to stop.

Case in point may be the mainspring. It's not a lot more difficult to swap a mainspring housing than it is to put a magazine in the gun. You need a punch, but that's all, and you can use the hammer strut for that. However, you really don't want to swap the actual spring in the housing without some practice.

(You really aren't supposed to remove the firing pin and extractor either, but that's a whole lot simpler.)

I'm a beginner too, really, in terms of the 1911. I've got a Commander I've been fiddling with for a couple months. I inherited it from a friend who had it set up a bit strangely, and never had a chance to ask him why. Knock wood, it's working properly, but there's a spare extractor in the parts bin, just in case.

I also have a Para Tac-Four (that's the avatar picture) that I've tricked out just a little bit. It has magazine problems (crappy factory mags, actually), but otherwise is fine. El Commandante won't admit it's a 1911, but it's a double-stacked Commander-sized .45 with Para's "LDA" - Light Double Action. I think it's a little safer to carry than "Condition One", but I wouldn't buy another double-stacker. Between the two, I'm learning a LOT about Browning's design....

(I'm not a beginning shooter, though. I started that in 1967, but just got back into serious regular range time about six months ago. Which is good 'cause you have to test these things :D . I like testing them....)

[swampertwo]

I've found that a wood handled "stainless toothbrush"-small wire brush- gives good control when you push the follower down to pin it and change the spring/follower. Also works well for compressing the new spring to pin it to get the new follower in.
Jeff

[SMMAssociates]

I've found that a wood handled "stainless toothbrush"-small wire brush- gives good control when you push the follower down to pin it and change the spring/follower. Also works well for compressing the new spring to pin it to get the new follower in.
Jeff

Jeff:

My late father was a Dentist. He'd probably come back and haunt me if I advocated using a toothbrush that way :eek: . But it's a good idea. You already probably have something like that for cleaning magazines anyway. The Brownells tool just happens to fit well inside the spring loops....

I've found that flossing stuff - those super-tiny brushes - and pipe cleaners are handy too. My best discovery, I think, was in a drugstore about three months ago. I was looking for some cheaper than dirt Q-tips and found some (rather expensive ones) that have a point on one end, and a flat cotton tip on the other. These were in with the "makeup" stuff rather than where you'd usually find 'em. Good thing I had my wife with me :D .

In a 1911, these are handy for digging around in the extractor tube and some other really tight areas. My Para's got a groove in the slide that these match exactly, too. They're also handy for rails....

(I've got an S&W "Escort" here. Looks like a Derringer, but it's a .22LR semi-auto. Q-tips do the job better than standard patches & rods. Good quality, but the gun is sort of a backup to your backup. I don't find it too reliable. Good for a lot of looks, though. A gift....)

[wichaka]

Just load 2-3 rounds of ammo in the mag, then insert something thru one of the holes to hold the spring. No need to make a tool.........

[SMMAssociates]

Wichaka:

WAY too simple....

(I think Rube Goldberg was a relative....)

However, I had to make the tool for my Para. Wolff springs, removeable bottom plate, and for some reason it's about impossible to get the plate off without that split screwdriver. Not easy to get it back on either.

When I needed to muck with the 1911 magazines, I had that one, and the Brownells tool, so....

[wichaka]

I've not worked with that of floor plate. All the ones I've messed with have the simple pin in the middle of the plate to push in that releases it.

[SMMAssociates]

Wichaka:

Para uses a snap-off plastic floorplate on their double-stackers. It's real simple, but it almost begs for a spring with a looped end on it so you can deal with it with your fingers, and where the end is someplace convenient so you can get the floorplate on it. Other than that, it's OK.... I'm concerned that the lips on the plastic part will eventually get worn past reliability, but so far they don't show much wear. Not an issue with the 10-round mags for the P13 or Tac-Four. All the spring load is taken up by the "plug" base. What keeps that together seems to be magic.

I really prefer the "pin in the center" types, but that's what came with my Para. The Commander turned up with three very GI magazines with non-removeable flooplates. Didn't take long to figure out how to get those apart, but I've always wondered whether the cost of welding or crimping a baseplate to the tube was much more than a removeable floorplate when you consider the need to disassemble and clean the things once in a while without some klutz destroying the follower or doing something evil to the springs.

[1911Tuner]

Just load 2-3 rounds of ammo in the mag, then insert something thru one of the holes to hold the spring. No need to make a tool.........

Dang...Wichaka beat me to it! :cool: That's what I git for goin' ta be so early. :D

[wichaka]

My best guess for the welded floor plate, is because JMB designed it that way. I think it gives more support to the whole mag structure as well.

Remember what the 1911 was designed for.........Military use, and hard use & abuse at that.

Since the gun was designed to be detail stripped in the field by using its own parts it stands to reason that simplicity was there in the mag as well. Put 2-3 rounds in the mag slip the firing pin thru one of the holes.......and it comes apart.


Tuner;
Dang...Wichaka beat me to it! That's what I git for goin' ta bed so early.

Didn't have enough of that turbo coffee yesterday eh? I keep tellin' you to throw in a horseshoe.......a used one at that, it adds a little more punch ya know.

[SMMAssociates]

My best guess for the welded floor plate, is because JMB designed it that way. I think it gives more support to the whole mag structure as well.

Remember what the 1911 was designed for.........Military use, and hard use & abuse at that.

You're right about that. I imagine the magazines were intended to be expendable, or at least inexpensive enough to toss if necessary without too much paperwork, kinda like the stripper clips of that era.

Since the gun was designed to be detail stripped in the field by using its own parts it stands to reason that simplicity was there in the mag as well. Put 2-3 rounds in the mag slip the firing pin thru one of the holes.......and it comes apart.

I think JB was related to Rube Goldberg. I think I may have been too....

The coffee is ready when the horseshoe sinks. The chili is ready when it dissolves.... :eek:

[wichaka]

No, No..........its ready when the horseshoe stands up.