3ACR_Scout
30th April 2006, 03:43
Hi guys,
I'm brand new to this forum, and also brand new to collecting 1911s. I've been interested in World War II history since high school, and I hope to collect examples of the various historic US weapons from that conflict. I started with a CMP Garand and have been wanted to buy a 1911A1 for a while. I hadn't really thought about an earlier 1911, but I came across a Colt at a show today that was, according to the guy that the dealer acquired it from, refurbished / rebuilt for service in World War II. The pistol appears to be in good condition, and looks like it may have an interesting history. My knowledge of the production and variations in Model 1911 pistols is limited to what I've read in Clawson's collector's guide, so please be patient if I screw up some information or terminology...
The pistol is obviously a bit mismatched as one would expect of a weapon that went through a military refurb. Most significantly, the pistol has been parkerized (I can hear the collectors cringing!), with the exception of the slide stope (probably a replacement part) and I think the barrel, although maybe the barrels weren't parkerized?. While the frame appears to be of 1918 manufacture (serial no. 4746XX), the slide looks like it was swapped from an earlier gun. The slide has Roman style lettering, while the frame is printed in the later block style. I think the hammer may also be an earlier style than the frame should have. The finish (or refinish) is in pretty good shape, with some visible scratches in the finish itself but no major damage to any of the metal components that I can see, except for wear on the tops of the sights and where the frame rails rub against the sides of the slide at the front. There's a bit of wear on the finish at the front of the slide, but not what I would normally consider to be holster wear.
Here's a rough photo - I'll take some more in better light during the day tomorrow:
http://www.mindspring.com/~drolsen/M1911a.jpg
A couple questions for you experts:
- Are these types of refurbished 1911s pretty common, and where they normally parkerized like this? This is the first time I've seen one, so I just wanted to make sure that the parkerizing isn't something a previous owner did. The dealer said the guy he got it from wasn't really a collector, but said that this pistol was rebuilt for World War II. Can anyone tell me where I could find out some info about this process? The dealer suggested I could contact Colt's historian but that I'd have to pay a fee for the research.
- Should I bother trying to match up the parts on this pistol a little better? Is it possible to find parkerized 1911 (as opposed to 1911A1) parts anywhere? I'd like to replace the slide catch so that its finish matches the rest of the pistol, but I'd like to use a 1911 part. Would it be possible to find a parkerized 1911 slide somewhere that would more closely match the production features of the frame? I'm guessing I'd have to look for another parkerized 1911 and hope that the slides could be swapped. As is, I think the pistol is an interesting old warrior and in good shape, so I'm not sure I want to put a lot of money into trying to make it "perfect," since it would never be an "as-issued" 1911. I have a feeling there are probably some 1911A1 parts mixed into this pistol from the rebuild anyway, plus the new finish, of course.
- I know this pistol can't really be considered a collector's firearm because of the finish and modifications, but I was curious what a 1911 like this is worth. I have a feeling it's kind of a "beater" as far as 1911s go, but I paid $650 for this pistol, which to me was well worth it for an example of a World War II pistol, and if nothing else, for a piece of history that's almost 90 years old. I'm not prepared to drop $1500 or more on a 1911 before I learn more about their production and features, so I thought this would be a good starting point for collecting some interesting historical pieces. I plan to fire this pistol occasionally, by the way - I wanted a 1911 to fire along side my Garand, not a shelf piece.
Thanks in advance for your comments and feedback.
Dave
I'm brand new to this forum, and also brand new to collecting 1911s. I've been interested in World War II history since high school, and I hope to collect examples of the various historic US weapons from that conflict. I started with a CMP Garand and have been wanted to buy a 1911A1 for a while. I hadn't really thought about an earlier 1911, but I came across a Colt at a show today that was, according to the guy that the dealer acquired it from, refurbished / rebuilt for service in World War II. The pistol appears to be in good condition, and looks like it may have an interesting history. My knowledge of the production and variations in Model 1911 pistols is limited to what I've read in Clawson's collector's guide, so please be patient if I screw up some information or terminology...
The pistol is obviously a bit mismatched as one would expect of a weapon that went through a military refurb. Most significantly, the pistol has been parkerized (I can hear the collectors cringing!), with the exception of the slide stope (probably a replacement part) and I think the barrel, although maybe the barrels weren't parkerized?. While the frame appears to be of 1918 manufacture (serial no. 4746XX), the slide looks like it was swapped from an earlier gun. The slide has Roman style lettering, while the frame is printed in the later block style. I think the hammer may also be an earlier style than the frame should have. The finish (or refinish) is in pretty good shape, with some visible scratches in the finish itself but no major damage to any of the metal components that I can see, except for wear on the tops of the sights and where the frame rails rub against the sides of the slide at the front. There's a bit of wear on the finish at the front of the slide, but not what I would normally consider to be holster wear.
Here's a rough photo - I'll take some more in better light during the day tomorrow:
http://www.mindspring.com/~drolsen/M1911a.jpg
A couple questions for you experts:
- Are these types of refurbished 1911s pretty common, and where they normally parkerized like this? This is the first time I've seen one, so I just wanted to make sure that the parkerizing isn't something a previous owner did. The dealer said the guy he got it from wasn't really a collector, but said that this pistol was rebuilt for World War II. Can anyone tell me where I could find out some info about this process? The dealer suggested I could contact Colt's historian but that I'd have to pay a fee for the research.
- Should I bother trying to match up the parts on this pistol a little better? Is it possible to find parkerized 1911 (as opposed to 1911A1) parts anywhere? I'd like to replace the slide catch so that its finish matches the rest of the pistol, but I'd like to use a 1911 part. Would it be possible to find a parkerized 1911 slide somewhere that would more closely match the production features of the frame? I'm guessing I'd have to look for another parkerized 1911 and hope that the slides could be swapped. As is, I think the pistol is an interesting old warrior and in good shape, so I'm not sure I want to put a lot of money into trying to make it "perfect," since it would never be an "as-issued" 1911. I have a feeling there are probably some 1911A1 parts mixed into this pistol from the rebuild anyway, plus the new finish, of course.
- I know this pistol can't really be considered a collector's firearm because of the finish and modifications, but I was curious what a 1911 like this is worth. I have a feeling it's kind of a "beater" as far as 1911s go, but I paid $650 for this pistol, which to me was well worth it for an example of a World War II pistol, and if nothing else, for a piece of history that's almost 90 years old. I'm not prepared to drop $1500 or more on a 1911 before I learn more about their production and features, so I thought this would be a good starting point for collecting some interesting historical pieces. I plan to fire this pistol occasionally, by the way - I wanted a 1911 to fire along side my Garand, not a shelf piece.
Thanks in advance for your comments and feedback.
Dave