Les Baer in sand???

[novak1911freak]

I have heard that some 1911s don't do so well in environments that have alot of sand. I really like Les Baer but with how tight they claim to be out of the box, will as tight as the Les Baer is, will it perform even if it gets sandy???

[Deacon Aegis]

Novak1911freak,
Ya gotta be a gorilla just to cycle some of these LB's right out of the box. These brutes are designed for supreme accuracy and from what I've gathered really only start hitting their first level of break-in at about 2000 rounds. I don't believe this is the case with all LB 1911's, but they are pretty much the type of gun you competition carry. Sand, debri of any kind will naturally effect the functionality of any machine with tollerances as tight as these bad boys have. If your looking for something that goes bang every time, even after sitting in the mud under a duece and half's tire, you'll want something with a bit more slop in its tollerances. You sacrifice some accuracy, no doubt, but it is the slop that allows the mechanics to handle grit and dirt and keep on going. You might want to check with Joni Lynn if you catch her online and still have some questions. She's got a couple of LB's I think and knows them inside and out.

(Irrellivent to the topic - I want a Laes Baer Monolith Heavyweight so bad I can taste it...) :D

[lustgarden]

Deacon if you want the Monolith just order it. I just ordered my second Baer.
I tried to justify it and couldn't. I am such a tightwad when it comes to money.
I decided I would rather have another Baer than the money sitting in the bank.
Life is too short.

[Deacon Aegis]

Aye, true dat, believe it or not though even this very afternoon I'm meeting with a gentleman concerning some acreage at 3, if things look promising there, I may become a bit of a tight-wad until I get through the hoops on that.

[lustgarden]

Novak
Personally if I wanted a sidearm to carry in a sandy environment it would be a Glock
I have had many of them and they always work every time.

[Monolith45]

Ordered my Monolith about two weeks ago and I love it. Check out the post "My New Toy" it explains it all. The best 1911 I have ever owned. By far. I read an article in one of the gun rags that some guy bought one and put it in a bucket of sand and water and it ran just fine. Because it was so tight the sand couldn't get in the damn thing. Besides you don't want to pay $1800 for a pistol and take it to the sand and destroy it. These things are almost like works of art. Not safe queens, but to be charished none the less.

[Gunfighter45]

I saw Les Baers while I was at Gunsite and they seemed to function fine in that sandy environment(unlike some other big names I won't mention). I came home and bought one.

[Jim 1855]

I've run two brand new Baers PIIs at Gunsite and then a Custom Carry, my regular piece, through multiple other classes. This gun has been through classes in rock, sand, dirt & rain. Maybe 10-15,000 rounds in training classes aside from normal shooting. Never had a Baer jam from dirt. Did break a sear once, LBC fixed w/o problems, I paid shipping.

I clean every night during a class because I can, not because I'm worried about the guns.

Don't worry about the dirt. Break it in with about 500 rounds, keep it lubed and clean the bore regularly during break-in. Then shoot it and enjoy it.

I own other great 1911s but the Baer Custom Carry is a favorite; it may not be pretty anymore but it always goes bang.

Jim

[Frank]

My Concept IV went through Gunsite without a hiccup, and I've got a PII I've used for IPSC that's seen something like 30,000 rounds without a malfunction. These guns have not been pampered and don't need pampering.

DVC

[novak1911freak]

Thanks everybody for your replies, it was just what I needed to decide that I want to buy a Les Baer, now.....what model to choose......choices, choices. I think to start I want to get either a Thunder Ranch Special or a Custom Carry....

[Jim 1855]

I don't think it makes a big difference whether you choose the TR or the CC.
I own a CC, fitted mag well, ambi-safeties, 30 lpi and MMC adjustable night sights. This has been by regular training and all around use gun (not carry). It's been great. Lots of rounds and still real tight.
The TR is really nice too but generally doesn't come with ambi-safeties which I need as I shoot both right (primary) and left hand. I damaged a wrist a few years back and can't shoot for long right handed.
The TR also has thinner grips which I don't find as comfortable.
Either gun will be great it's just a matter of preferences.
Jim

[lustgarden]

Novak
I just ordered a cc commanche with single side safety. It is just a matter of preference like Jim says. It took me a long time to decide what my second baer would be. This is what I finally decided on for my ccw. The P2 I shoot targets with. It just depends on what you are going to use it for. They are all nice and it makes it hard to decide. Then you have to decide what finish you want. No matter which Baer you get you are going to be happy with it.

[dogdollar]

I have MANY pistols - 7 of them 1911's and include all of the Big Three. (See "Hangin' Out with the Boys" post.)
My favorite ? No question.
Ultimate Master. Got the magwell, got the ambi, tight as a drum and, most of all, dead nuts accurate. This pistol will let you know how good of a shot you really are. It is also fairly concealable in a Milt Sparks Summer Special. The feel of this gun in my hand makes me confident.
That's just my two cents, but I believe any LB you choose will serve you well.
Good luck !!!!
Dogdollar

[myjarreth]

If I got sand in my Baer I'd clean it. Bury your kids in the sand, not your baer.

[Monolith45]

If I got sand in my Baer I'd clean it. Bury your kids in the sand, not your baer.


YOUR DAMN RIGHT!

[Ping Ping]

Ditto the Glock suggestion. I recall reading that somewhere along the way, the Gov't altered the tolerances to loosen up the 1911 to improve reliability. Modern Customs have gone back to tighter inorder to improve accuracy. This said, the 1911 platform is definitely not the best choice for a silica laden environment. Having ridden mountain bikes over countless miles in the southern Utah desert, I can tell you that sand gets into ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING. Ive found it in sealed bearings, steering tubes, hydraulic shock tubes... EVERYWHERE. Ive even found it down inside an unopened sleeping bag stuff sack LOL! But then, this is the finest erosion particulate on the planet. Beach and coral sand are not nearly as insidious.
Interesting anecdote: A cop friend recently told me that the SIG rep came to demo pistols at their training range. He carried in two buckes of sand. When he dumped out the buckets there were 10 pistols in each. They proceeded to test the guns without a failure. DOH!
Disclaimer: DO NOT TRY THIS WITH ANY 1911 :nono:

[Frank]

Actually, I think that a Les Baer or other properly set up high end 1911 will function as well under adverse conditions as pretty much anything else. When I detail strip my 1911s I notice that there are plenty of nooks and crannies where the crud collects out of the way of the moving parts.

In the 2006 edition of the Guns & Ammo The Complete Book of the Model 1911 (https://store.primediamags.com/shop/shooting/viewAisle/sa_id/280), there's an article by Patrick Sweeney describing his torture testing of several 1911s, including a Wilson CQB and a Kimber Warrior (together with Charles Daly and an RIA). The tests included burying the guns in mud, in sand and in a mixture of talcum powder and sugar. According to Sweeney, they all functioned 100% even under these conditions. (None of them cycled reliably when fired under water. But then again, what would?)

I'm sure that there are ways that you can get a 1911 to stop working. But I think that under those conditions almost anything else will quit on you as well.

DVC

[Monolith45]

Ditto the Glock suggestion. I recall reading that somewhere along the way, the Gov't altered the tolerances to loosen up the 1911 to improve reliability. Modern Customs have gone back to tighter inorder to improve accuracy. This said, the 1911 platform is definitely not the best choice for a silica laden environment. Having ridden mountain bikes over countless miles in the southern Utah desert, I can tell you that sand gets into ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING. Ive found it in sealed bearings, steering tubes, hydraulic shock tubes... EVERYWHERE. Ive even found it down inside an unopened sleeping bag stuff sack LOL! But then, this is the finest erosion particulate on the planet. Beach and coral sand are not nearly as insidious.
Interesting anecdote: A cop friend recently told me that the SIG rep came to demo pistols at their training range. He carried in two buckes of sand. When he dumped out the buckets there were 10 pistols in each. They proceeded to test the guns without a failure. DOH!
Disclaimer: DO NOT TRY THIS WITH ANY 1911 :nono:

One of the 5 1911's that I own is a REAL Colt 1911 manufactured in 1918. And I also own 4 Glocks and a Sig 220. And I am going to tell you that my original 1911 is easily as reliable as any Glock or Sig that I own and it is 88 years old. It is also really accurate with all original parts except for the grips, and it's WWII barrel. And yes I do shoot it quite regularly with mild reloads because the metal was softer back then. The manufactures did not start heat treating them until WWII. And yes it rattles like you would not believe and I can still stack shots on top of one another with it. Not like some high end junky Kimbers that I have owned in the past.

Here's an interesting anecdote: Henrico county sheriffs dept. here in Richmond VA. Recently sh*t canned their BRAND NEW Sig 220's because they we're jammin, ALOT! And went with the Glock 22.

[Ping Ping]

PM me when you get around to packing your $30,000 vintage 1911 in sand. I will fly to where ever you are in the WORLD to see this! :scared: (even though it will make me cry)

My series 70 is the same way. Im always thinkin in terms of stuff you can go out n buy on a saturday morning. Im not advocating or debunking sigs... just thought it was an interesting marketing ploy.

[littledoc]

Here's an interesting anecdote: Henrico county sheriffs dept. here in Richmond VA. Recently sh*t canned their BRAND NEW Sig 220's because they we're jammin, ALOT! And went with the Glock 22.

That's interesting. I was there when Henrico Co. decided to go with the Sig over the Glock 21 because the Sig had a lower failure rate during their testing. :confused: