staking in front site

[shucks]

The WC front blade on my 1911 fell off while shooting yesterday. i fitted it back in the groove and it is still a little loose, making me think it will fly off again when I shoot it. Is this something i can work on myself, or do o have to have a smith look at it? I was thinking that if i could take it out and fill the gap with some silver solder, reinsert it while it's hot, maybe that would hold it.

[John]

First of all, you are new here, so please read the Forum Rules. This question has nothing to do with Colt, it's a gunsmithing question, so I'll move it there. Remember to post your messages in the proper forums in the future, if you do not want to get warned.

Second. Yes, indeed you can silver-solder it in place, actually this is the prefered way to do it, but it's not as simple as you think. You need to "dig" the inside of the slide, below the sight, so that you can stake on the front sight, at least partially. Then you silver-solder it from the inside. The tenon should be slightly deformed so that it creates a surface which together with the solder, keeps the sight in the slide.

[Hunter]

Mine got a little loose on my Colt and I used a punch and small brass hammer to refold the stake of the front sight over and then used the edge of a flat file to finish peening the sight flush. I put one end of the file edge ways over the front sight stake then the other end supported. With that brass hammed I tapped the end of the file closest to the front sight to finish folding over the stake. I used a piece of 600 grit to dress the inside of the slide. Brownells sells a front sight staking tool which is way easier to use but this will get me by until my next trip to see 1911Tuner and I will try and sweet talk him into helping me out (again). When brazing you must be careful no to loose the temper on the slide or possibly warp it.

[greatgoogamooga]

I have to disagree with siver soldering being the preferred way to do it (no offence to the poster of this suggestion, I know it's commonly done). Yes, it wil help hold it in place, but can mess up a nice bluing job and make it harder to replace the sight later.

The correct way to do it is to cut out a shallow depression in the inside of the slide to give the rivet a place to flow. I have staked on 3 sights this way without soldering them and they stay put just fine. The first two I did with a plain old punch...well, a few punches of differnt shapes, actually. The last one with the Kings armorers staking tool. The punches worked better.

You can also use the permanent Loctite to hold it in place...again not necesary, but I'd prefer that over solder.

Goog

[John]

I have to disagree with siver soldering being the preferred way to do it (no offence to the poster of this suggestion, I know it's commonly done). Yes, it wil help hold it in place, but can mess up a nice bluing job and make it harder to replace the sight later.

I won't argue with that, I have no personal experience doing it, so I can't tell if the blueing gets damaged, it may very well do. I had it done to my guns in the past, but the gun was always reblued afterwards, so I do not know.

[Gammon]

Been there, done that, guys. I used a .45 in IPSC competition for many years and shot off many front sights. After many such failures, I found a gunsmith who would silver solder the front sight. Guess what? Only slightly longer life span for the sight; it still fell off. The problem was using a high visibility front sight (read: heavy) in a Pre Series 80 pistol. The older guns used a narrow tenon to secure the front sight which just couldn't take the stress of a heavy front sight. Series 80 pistols use a much thicker tenon which seems to be more than adequate, I own two which have kept their front sights despite many thousands of rounds fired.
Back to the older 1911s. When I returned one of my .45s to the local smith for another silver soldered front sight (the guy stood behind his work, but he was getting tired of replacing my front sights on warantee) he claimed that he could stake the sight on with better reliability than soldering. He then showed me a jig made by MMC that held the front sight in position and staked it at the same time. Unfortunately, the sight lasted about as long as silver soldering, it did fall off. That's the bad news, the good news is that the jig cost me about $100; I bought one after the gunsmith gave me a hard time about replacing a front sight (I can't really blame him). The jig works like a charm, and will do the narrow tenon, pre-Series 80 sights, as well as the new thicker tenon Series 80 sights. the tool has more than paid for itself over the
last 15 years. This is definitely the way to go if you want to install your own front sights using the factory method.
The above is the best way to deal with front sight installations in stock Colts and clones, but time moves on. Dovetail front sights are really the only way to go. For a one time fee of about $60 you can have a dovetail cut in your slide and then install any sight you choose.

[John]

Dovetail front sights are really the only way to go. For a one time fee of about $60 you can have a dovetail cut in your slide and then install any sight you choose.


Here, here! I fully agree with you Sir.

[shucks]

This is a high vis site, with the really small tenon. I took some metal epoxy that matched the SS slide when dry, and dipped the tenon in it, then used a q-tip to fill in the groove. Used some padded needle nosed pliers to press it in and held it for an hour or so. She stuff is supposed to bond to the metals chemically. It looks great, and as of this morning, it is really tight, couldn't get any play in it with my hands. Good idea? Is it true that dove-tailing only costs 60.00 or so? If it comes off again, it looks like im gonna have to save up.

[Gammon]

This is a high vis site, with the really small tenon. I took some metal epoxy that matched the SS slide when dry, and dipped the tenon in it, then used a q-tip to fill in the groove. Used some padded needle nosed pliers to press it in and held it for an hour or so. She stuff is supposed to bond to the metals chemically. It looks great, and as of this morning, it is really tight, couldn't get any play in it with my hands. Good idea? Is it true that dove-tailing only costs 60.00 or so? If it comes off again, it looks like im gonna have to save up.


I hpoe the fix works, but I am doubtful. Check out Dawson Precision or EGW for a price on the dovetail.

[Jim Clark]

I agree with the 'DoveTail', it is the best and I'm fortunate enough to have a milling machine. So I can do my own (and friends). I'm also fortunate enough to have a TIG welder. I put the sight in by the staking method and then put the slide in water upsidedown,( not getting the to be welded part wet) and just surface melt the two together quickly.

It hasn't caused any blueing problems yet. I make sure to do it quickly.

jim

[John]

Any houses for rent near yours? If I am to immigrate to US, I may as well live next to someone with useful tools. On a second thought, I may prefer Lynnie's area, since I haven't seen your guns yet. :p

[ducky]

I also suggest coating the tenon in 271 red loctite as a cheap alternative. I took this route on one of my Colts and several thousand rounds later the front sight has yet to budge. Once seated with the loctite, apply a little more inside the slide where the bottom of the tenon sits for extra coverage. Aside from holding like crazy, it doesn't affect the bluing a bit. Just make sure to wipe off the excess.

My $1.23

[Gammon]

I also suggest coating the tenon in 271 red loctite as a cheap alternative. I took this route on one of my Colts and several thousand rounds later the front sight has yet to budge. Once seated with the loctite, apply a little more inside the slide where the bottom of the tenon sits for extra coverage. Aside from holding like crazy, it doesn't affect the bluing a bit. Just make sure to wipe off the excess.

My $1.23

271 is a great adhesive to use in front sight installation. I use it with every front sight I install. The big problem here is older guns (pre-Series 80) with the narrow tenon and a high visibilty sight. The weight of the sight will eventually break it off, no matter how well it has been installed, including silver soldering. My experience has taught me that once the front sight comes off, you will be better off having a dove tail sight installed to solve the problem for good, and save money in the long run. If you don't, be prepared to repeat the installation procedure. I have, several times.

[shucks]

the loctite didnt hold well for some reason, dont know why, couple mags and the site was gone. i soldered it, and aside from a couple blisters, seems to be holding great. Thanks guys, and i'll keep you posted.

[jeff1124]

I just got an email back from EGW stating that they will dovetail your slide for only 30.00 if you provide the sight. I have already bought a set of sights, Wilson low rise night sights from MidwayUSA, thinking that I would try to install only the rear and spring for the dovetailing later, but now I think I may as well have them dovetail for the front. I'll install the rear sight first just in case there is an issue with the fit of that dovetail.

[Gammon]

Sounds like a good deal. EGW has done some work for me and I was pleased with the results. I am about to ship them a slide for some machine work.